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[Rodney]

if you do go up there PLEASE don't fish for the rock cod their not in good shape and should be left alone.
I've seen the population of cod drop so bad over the years it's unbelievable .The boats that would show up in the last 15 to 20 years and take every fish from 4" rock cod 3perch was sick, what ever came to the boat was dead and I'm sorry to say on this site they where Asians and I'm not Trying to be an old red neck but it's the truth.
I see people always talking about the rock cod that they got for Indian Arm and I sill can under stand why they can't just leave the area to rebound to what it was.There is so many places and other types of fish to go after, why target something that takes so long to reproduce,I don't get it.

dan brought up a good point. Unfortunately, groundfish such as rockfish species are popular food fish among Asians, particularly Chinese. Simply go to a Chinese seafood restaurant, or supermarket and you'll find live rockfish swimming in tanks, ready to be bought. Most are unaware of the biology of fish that they are eating, so demand continues to rise while populations decline. Just a few years ago, there were charter boats operated from Steveston and brought anglers out to specifically target large rockfish and lingcod. Since the rockfish conservation measures came in effect, these charters have either shut down or moved onto the island.

As long as the daily quota remains at one fish in these waters that are mentioned above, people will continue to go out and harvest. The important thing for people to know is that if you choose to target them, catch your one fish and fish for something else. This is not a catch and release fishery, most fish brought up from great depth are hard to revive.

The public needs to be educated more if anglers attitude towards groundfish is to be changed. At our annual BC Family Fishing Weekend event, information on groundfish has been available in the last three years. I feel that the same information should also be printed in Chinese, Vietnamese etc.

[glycine]

it is productive topic.

think about it!

how long it would take to reproduce rockfishes? how about salmonides?

how much amount of fishes are caught annually? which is the greater amount? salmonides? or rock fishes?

of caurse asians loves rock fishes but they dont like salmons..

next!!

how much amount of license & tax money is used for rockfishes.. ? how about for salmonides?

anyone have ever heard about rock fish hatchery? do you know how many salmon hatcheries in bc?


actually DFO is doing sth for rock fish  population.. they reduced daily limit, closed several areas against bottom fishing.  and, THATS ALL!!!!!


Rock fishes are not commercially important species for DFO. THEY dont really care about ROCK FISHES. and, IMPORTANT THING IS their populations are going down rapidly..


in my home country, korea, the government has lots of programs to reserve rock fishes. they setting artificial reefs in the bottom of the ocean, they release great amount of small fishes every year.  those are not such a money consuming projects.. why DFO doesnt learn that stuffs?

anyway.. it is very unfair that bottom fishers feel guilty while salmon fishers are enjoying their beautiful day , unless they do not violate fishery regulations..   sry for my grammer..

thanks Rodney for reminding me that bottom fishing is not catch and release problem. if you need korean edition information, i can help you.

[lucky]

 I dont feel that I have let out any big secrets by posting this report, and I doubt that the Arm will be packed with unethical fisherman targeting rockcod. First off you would need a boat, and even then they are not that easy to find. Unless you lived very close it woulndt even be worth while. Actually I have seen more rockfish caught off the peir at Ambleside. I am out in the Indian Arm every weekend and only once in a while will I target rockfish, mainly because they are so hard to find and when I do fish for them I never fish the same area twice always looking for new spots. Until the dfo decides that a total closure is in need I will continue to fish for them every now and then. Both my inlaws are retired trying to get by on a very modest government pension, so it is  a real treat for them to be able to eat something they probably couldnt afford to eat if I didnt catch it. And being asian they make sure the whole fish is used, only thing they dont eat is the bones and guts, and I might be wrong about the guts.

[FISHIN MAGICIAN]

GLYCINE>>YOU ARE OFF YOUR ROCKER!!!!

First of all, fishing for ROCKFISH requires no skill. PERIOD. Get any piece of meat, and drop it down to the bottom, and if there is something to bite it, it will. HATCHERIES FOR ROCKFISH? WHAT??? YOU GOTTA BE KIDDING ME!!!! What is wrong with conservation?

FURTHERMORE>>>WHERE IS THE SPORT IN A ROCKCOD? EVEN 50 lb lings come up pretty easy..and I have plain and simple told my guests that if a monster like that does bite the line, we release it.

Otherwise, we have hatcheries because it allows wild stocks to rebuild. I don't know if you have any real idea of the biology of rockfish on this side of the PACIFIC but let's just say, we hardly have enough money to support Salmon let alone ROCKFISH...and I PAY SIGNIFICANT $$$$ and donate $$$$ to plenty of conservation programs.

I DON"T SEE GROUND FISHERS GIVING DIDDLEY BACK TO THE RESOURCE!!!

I have worked for the five top ranked lodges and locations on the coast, and I CAN TELL YOU that I have fished far too many meat hunters to know better about the ATTITUDES of people that fish the %%%% out our waters.

I recall taking a group of 4 out for an afternoon, and I had to limit them out on everything, and the waters were such that I couldn't help but do it without even trying!!!!

At any rate, they are BANNED from 4 of those lodges now. Either way, they took home limits of everything, and even brought their nets so we could go for herring.

POACHERS, and MEAT HUNTERS and other IDIOTS SICKEN ME and if I ever get into public office, anyone caught poaching will face fines so steep that if they get caught, they will never poach again. FURTHERMORE I WILL GET LEGISLATION PASSED SO THAT ALL PERSONAL PROPERTY Used to commit the offense will be appropriated legally and then sold off at auction to fund enhancement.

[BwiBwi]

Not to raise a war here but if you are sick and tired, why not quit the job? If they need people take them out to fish that means they don't know how to do it on their own or simply they don't have the resource to do so.

Stop picking on who fish for what. But focus on what can be done to increase fish stock not just conserve.

We live in a nice wealthy country, next to none existence of mulnutricien. Look at southern Asia, Africa, etc.... They wouldn't give a damn if its salmon or whatsoever, they'll eat at anything.  With increasing demand of food source, and trying to keep deforestation at bay, land clearing for agricultural use is just not right.  And since ocean takes up most part of this planet, aquaculture is the ticket.

Think of it this way.  Today we conserve rockfish fishery, tomorrow we conserve this and that, at day end the fishery thats still open would see greater pressure.  Conservation is not the way to go. It is only a short term solution its like 'well we just wait it out and hope the problem would just go away'.
Government should encourage programs to research and promote safe aquaculture.  This might be a long shot but a stewardship program can be put in and companies engaged in the aquaculture can ie. stealhead farms, for every 100 stealhead smolt raised the company should 'donate' 1 to DFO for release. Something like that.  So that everyone wins.

[Ho whacker]

A few things.

One. If your guiding people, chances are they are not going to get a chance to fish for those spieces normaly anyway so who cares if someone wants to make the best of an opertunity to fish where they can get lots of good tasting fish as long as they obey the regulations.
Two. I went up to squamish not too long ago trying to go to the Indian river and the gate was closed. Unless they have recently opened it you need to have a rock crawler or some bolt cutters to get through.
Three. Ive fished the Indian arm a few times in the past few years and I definatly would not recomend it as a consistant rock cod place. Although there are places where you can catch rock cod in there If you where to be targeting them you have to go as far as the island.

[FISHIN MAGICIAN]

Bwi Bwi,  I wouldn't use the term "picking" on people who fish for "what".

People like I took out averaged $2500 a day for 4 days. Does the fact that they spent that money to go to that lodge entitle them to indiscrimately limit out on everything that is available? I think not.

And on another note, your argument is incongruous about people that fish the bottom.

At any rate, last Saturday morning I was at the pier at White Rock, while waiting for a friend for breakfast, I took a stroll down to the end. I had just previously been bothered and rudely treated while obliging to a woman's demands for change for the parking meter. She had a nearly new mid size import car. Obviously she decided to unload her monthly supply of pocket change of dimes and nickels in exchange for my twoons and loons in my pocket. At any rate, with a smile, I obliged and made change for 4 dollars worth of her "dimes and nickels".

So, realizing that I was just a bit early, I went out to the end of the pier. When I got about 3/4 a way to the end I note that six people were walking towards me with an inflatable raft, 2 people were carrying the inflatable dingy (not a cheap item by the way), and 4 others were carrying 5 gallon pails. At that point, I noticed the woman I had just given change to a few minutes earlier stride briskly past me up to them and grab another pail out of the raft and joining the group walking up the pier to the parking lot. Out of curiosity, I noticed that all the pails were full, and things were wrapped in newspaper. I asked "What's in the pails" and they said "Crabs" By my estimate, I am 100% certain that all SIX PEOPLE had 4 crabs each in those pails. That makes 24 crabs. I noted that there were no crab traps to be seen anywhere. HMMMM..interesting..

At which point I walked to the end of pier and noted again, NO TRAPS. At that point looking on the other side of the breakwater, I realized that there was a line of 5 floats, crab trap markers to be precise, with Yellow Poly Rope dangling down in the clear water to the traps below. How can these individuals have a full limit of crabs, and still have traps fishing? HMMMM

At which point I presumed that they would be returning for the traps later.

Now I don't know about you guys, and I can't say 100% for sure about the circumstances of what I saw, but I would be willing to wager a sum of money that those individuals did not all possess Salt Water licenses, nor did they really have an intention to feed their personal consumption of Dungeness and Red Rock Crab.

A resource is a resource, and by definition, a resource can be exploited for many means, but that does not mean that irresponsible individuals and the plight of their "finanicial means" and cultural, race, ethnic or whatever socio-economic backgrounds they belong to should stand in the way of prudent and just conservation and therefore morally dictate and govern their behaviours.

I see no need in a country laden with social safety nets, food banks, and  where strife and starvation have been eradicated on a scale far greater than many less fortunate areas of the world------where stewardship of any resource is not the sole responsiblity of those that use it.

Regardless of any criticisms of my posts, at this time I would like to state that for the record, my posts here are not intended to incite any kind of discriminatory or racial biases, but merely point out a viewpoint common to many who frequent these forums.  I am not a racist, and for the record, if I have offended anyone, for that I apologize. Although my tone may at times be provocative, please take it in the spirit that it is intended---and do not infer that I am a bigot or prejudicial purveyor of discrimation but my posts merely seek to state an opinion.

tight lines and may everyone enjoy the use of a resource in moderation with CONSERVATION first. As the sportsfishing institute of bc once said...."Catch your limit..but limit your catch".

tight lines to all.....

 

[BwiBwi]

You are most likely right about their fishing license, not too many family would buy license for the entire group.

Conservation is still a intermediate step. Eventually it will need more than just conserve.

For those that went to fishing lodge, and try to max out their catch I don't see why not.  4 fishing days with the possesion limit, they would be fishing two days only
Those fishing trips is not cheap.  It's not like they would be there every week. Most likely once or twice an year.

Why not let them have their catch?  At days end they are limited to a max of 8 salmon in possession(daily limit 4). and that is usually it for them for the whole year 

Locals may bring up 1 or 2 a day but after the entire season it would most likely be more than what they have caught.

[glycine]

dear fishin magician.

as long as you use civilized stuffs.... you are guilty against mother nature. 
some people catch fishes for their living, loggers destroy forest for pay checks, first nations kill seals for their nutrition.
when you use electricity you burn fossil fuel, contaminate with radioactive wastes, or, you destroy wild life by building hydro dam.
human populations are too large to concord with other species on earth. To harmony with our mother nature human organizations have produced lots of "handlings" such as fishery regulations, hatchery technologies.. and more projects will be taken.   

Rodny, bwi, and, Dan. these guys suggested many points to protect this beautiful country.

however, i couldnt get your point.. do i have to stop all of these civilized stuffs? or, quit fishing? which is more cruel killing fishes for food or for fun? do you really beleave all of fishes you released are revived?
i saw too many anglers who snaged salmons and released again at the mouth of seymour river two years ago, im pretty sure most of them failed to reproduce at the river. is it sports fishing?
the only thing i could felt from your posting is "anger". but against what? ground fishers, poachers, rudly parked asian woman, or, something else?

[FISHIN MAGICIAN]

glycine, you must be out to lunch. As for Bwi Bwi, he must be in la la land--with his utopia where conservation is not enough.

I never advocated the complete cease of any harvest of any natural resource period--although somehow you inferred that into what I said in plain and simple english. What I said was and implied was that the use of the resource must be governed by the state of the resource itself.

The way I look at it, Fisheries and Oceans Canada exists for the primary reason that overall, GREED and over utilization of the resource will mean the end of the resource.

Glycine, and Bwi Bwi, be my guest, and advocate what you advocate, and see exactly what that gets you. That's why we have limits--to prevent over harvest--and even then it is too much. And just because there is a liimit, doesn't mean that you should take it to the limit. That's all I said. In addition, unmonitored harvest of the resources means that there won't be any more resource. That's why hundreds of canneries on the coast shut down last century---even at that early stage--cuz it was all over.

I have a few oceanography courses under my belt and a few well founded and formed opinions about many of these issues, and if you guys have such great ideas, then get off your duff and do something about it--tell those people with Phds they have it all wrong, or better yet...get out there...write some learned papers, educate the public..and break some new ground, because I will tell you, sooner or later every saltwater fisher will require a 30 foot boat capable of running 50 to 75 miles offshore to catch a fish for sport..never mind hunting for meat like idiots that abuse the resource.

Going to be interesting to see what exactly the next 30 years hold, because I bet there will be a day in the next 50 years when a 40 lb salmon will cease to exist. I bet I will live to see a day when there will be a natural bait ban in saltwater. I bet there will be a day when saltwater fishing will be a sport reserved for the few that can afford outrageous sums of cash to fish.

Perhaps you guys think it is just fine to continue the way we have been continuing with the management of resources on this planet.....obviously in some capacity you do..and you obviously think that somehow things are acceptable at this point...to what point I don't know..but I do know one thing..it is likely that the attitudes of people like you guys that put us into this state of affairs that we find ourselves with--and in some small capacity, I imagine that you share those types of types of attitudes. Angry? Am I? Yes. I am angry, because at this point, it is needless that we find ourselves in the current state of affairs. and yes..that is my opinion..and that is all that it is...my opinion. I bode you guys good luck, and you guys better get fishing, cuz soon, there won't be any fish to catch---including 3 inch perch.

 

 

[BwiBwi]

Fish Magician,

Open your eyes. What's wrong with conservation, you asked.
Conservation in areas of high population and natural vulnerability does not have good chance of recovery anywhere in the world.  An active major is always required.  Land slide at Hope almost wipe out the entire Fraser salmon population, and numerous washouts had threatened number of salmon population along coastal streams and rivers.  Just last year, warm water temp has had tremendous impact on number of spawning salmon.  If conservation so work nicely as you like to believe.  Why not rotate salmon fishery closure in certain areas to conserve then we don’t have to spend so much on hatchery and management programs?

Don’t forget salmon grows at a faster pace than rockfish. And has higher population. Natural disasters can nearly wipeout an entire salmon stock in an area. Let along slow growing, slow repopulation rockfish.  Before a long imposed conservation effect for rockfish to repopulate can be realized, too high of a risk these areas may be lost to disaster.

Conservation without active programs is a losing battle.