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[Rodney]

If you roll your eyes any further, you are not going to be able to roll them back to where they should be...

[Eagleye]

I am not saying it doesn't exist.  Current adds to strength of pulling back.

Let me give you an example:
pulling against slower current say 1lb and your drag set at 1.5lb.  you gain line
pulling against faster current say 2lb cause the current is working against you, the reel will slip cause of drag setting. 

This is just an assumption number so I thought this would clear it up.

I think we are going way off topic.  You can phone me if you want and we can discuss this further more.  The OP must hate us now

You still haven't answered my question, where does the torque of the reel provided from the low gear ratio come into play according to your theory?

[Eagleye]

  LOL Rodney

[charles]

I don't know where the torque comes in.  To my understand, the torque will give you an easier time to reel with load.  But it is not to determine when fishing line is slip.  A higher torque reel with a 10lb drag set will slip line if the load is more than 10lbs.  And this will go with a lower torque reel as well.  Like your article pointed out 4 - 6 as high ratio and 2 - 3 is low ratio.  I am sure if you go to the lower ratio, the torque will be much more noticeable. 

Notice shimano did not make reel with different HEG.  Torque is not measured in how much a reel has compare to others.  It can be changed by gears as simple as changing the position of your handle bar.  So it is not a true way to measure or compare a reel from another reel. 

I am not one of those reel tester as my full time job.  But I do use reels for a longer period of time to know some different in reels.  And I do only talk about reels that I have used or tried.  It is not just something I thought up.  I am only passing on what I know with fishing with people in Hi's Tackle box, fisherman's landing, as well as talking to skippers fishing in the Barrier reef, and Tailand.  But I do learn of what I know fishing with people in Hi's both salt and fresh.  And I still do talk to them every once a while to scoop news about new reels. 
 

[Eagleye]

Notice shimano did not make reel with different HEG.  Torque is not measured in how much a reel has compare to others.  It can be changed by gears as simple as changing the position of your handle bar.  So it is not a true way to measure or compare a reel from another reel. 

Yes it is again the gear ratio number is for comparing torque and inches per crank is for retrieval speed.  I'm don't have the specs for every HEG reel but the ones with a higher ratio will have less torque.

[charles]

I am sure it is a bit hgiher...  But often it is not noticeable...

Remember how this post is started...  it is helping the OP to choose a reel.  How would the OP choose a reel thinking he can't find any information about comparsion of torque?  Even with each of the shimano reel, you can't measure the torque.   And there is no other way to compare to torque with other brand of reels.

Take a look at place that test reel.  Often enough, torque is no way mention or very min. for reels we talk about here.  It might be a big factors with 2 speed reels cause the ratio is so low. 

Ratio = 5:1 , 1 complete turn of your handle = 5 complete roll of your spool...  = line recovery rate...   

[charles]

I guess you can go by ratio to determine which reels have higher or lower torque.  But here comes the questions...
1) no way to determine if that 5:1 ratio gives so much more torque or noticable torque than the 6:1 ratio reel.
2) how do you compare a 5:1 ratio shimano reel to a 5:1 ratio diawa reel?  I would think with HEG and whatever diawa and abu system, a shimano 5:1 ratio HEG reel has different torque than the other companies with the same ratio reels.

I re-read the whole post again.  I have to admit that torque goes up as the speed or recovery rate or ratio goes down. 

And is it because the change is not noticeable that the companies do not bother to post it as a comparison?  Like your article pointed out, the ratio number is really used for anglers to determine lure retriveal rate until the point of low ratio 2:1 - 3:1...

It will be interesting if someone has the time to do a real test...
You can't change a ratio on say a 400 calcutta...  But we can change the ratio by changing the length of the handle.
I am not a math guy so I can't tell you.  But someone in here could figure out the numbers...
Regular handle for 5:1 ratio
A handle (determine length to change the ratio to 6.2:1 if possible).
A handle (determine length to change the ratio to 3:1 if possible).
tie a pound of weight
Predetermine the drag...  and reel in against the current...

This is my assumption:
1) all of them will slip if the pulling pressure is higher than the pre-determin drag setting.
2) 3:1 handle will reel in much easier but takes longer cause slower speed - less water friction coming in.
3) a 6:2-1 handle and the regular MIGHT reel in with harder effort compare to a 3:1handle but compare the regular and 6.2:1 handle the different might not noticable.

Or someone is rich enough to get all 3 ratio zillionaire and do a side by side comparison  

[JiG_Head]

this is so pointless...

you win, you happy?

[stlhd4ever]

You guys are a bunch of rambling fisherman. Time to give it a break. Torque really has nothing to do with gear ratio at all. Torque is what is being applied by you the fisherman as you turn the handle. Which in turn is supplied to the gears. The longer the handle the more torque being applied. All the gear ratio helps with is retreival speed. So everyone go ahead and buy the reel that you want to buy. Don't base it on these guys' ramblings. If it were me being the judge charles is the winner.    Rule of thumb the bigger the fish you are after the bigger the reel.

[firstlight]

Wow,did this ever go sideways.

[Drunker]

See guys, everyone is laughing at your guys.  Like i said, just come out and give it a try.  And at the same time, you will meet more people and stuff.  It's not about winning or losing.  It's all about exchanging ideas. 

Anyways, if any of you that comes out during the pink run, i will be on the fraser near the dock on No.3.  And i will be using my Antares AR. 

Drunker

[charles]

It is not about winning or losing...  Just sharing information and passing on to others...

I too will be fishing on the fraser in Richmond.

[dennisK]

Is it true that a longer rod gives you greater leverage on a fish?

Archimedes once said "give me a place to stand on, and I will move the earth."

Some people use short rods for big fish, would that not go against the logic of Archimedes?

[charles]

Dennis:

I can only tell you what I was told to use in boats in different areas...
In San Francisco, a longer rod 8-10' for fishing for Lings, football size tuna, cods, and salmon.  In NY, a shorter rod 4-5' for fishing for bluefish, large flounders.
In Australia, a shorter rod 4-5' for fishing for reef fish like cuda, wasse, and anything that is there.
Fishing for halibut here, I prefer my 6' rod.

I guess it is just the different styles in different places. 

[Eagleye]

Ratio = 5:1 , 1 complete turn of your handle = 5 complete roll of your spool...  = line recovery rate...   

I did not say gear ratios were not related to line recovery rate what I did say was inches per crank is a better way of comparing retrival speeds since spool size is also a factor.  ie A larger spool reel of the same gear ratio will retrieve line faster.  Personally I look at a gear ratio to determine the torque of a reel based on my previous experience using reels of various ratios.  You are right that Shimanos HEG will have more torque than a reel of the same ratio but that is what I said earlier that with new oversized gears it makes things more confusing but manufactures in the fishing industry seem to like to make it so.

stlhd4ever  Obviously you didn't even bother to read (or possibly understand) most of the thread as we are not talking about reels of different sizes we are comparing gear ratios.  Furthermore you can apply all the hand "torque" you want but if the line is slipping you are not acheiving anything this is where the torque of the reel comes into play.  Yes a longer handle will make it easier for you to reel in something heavy but if your gear ratio is too high it will require clamping down on the drag which can result in lost fish. ie when a big spring decides to make on last run as you get him in close, the result will be a broken leader, dislodged hook, etc.  I know I am wasting my time with you but torque is not only what the fisherman applies to the reel go back and read the thread so as to edumacte yourself.   


Jig Head Charles is right this is not about winning it is about learning and a debate is a good avenue for this.  I think it's about time we had some more informative posts instead of useless chatter.