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Author Topic: Fraser Closing ???  (Read 15449 times)

Rodney

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Re: Fraser Closing ???
« Reply #45 on: August 17, 2007, 12:34:16 PM »

http://www-ops2.pac.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/xnet/content/fns/index.cfm?pg=view_notice&lang=en&DOC_ID=103462&ID=recreational

Effective 00:01 hours Monday August 20, 2007 until further notice, there is no recreational fishing for all Salmon species from the downstream side of the CPR Bridge at Mission upstream to the Highway No. 1 Bridge at Hope, BC.

Current run size estimates of 120,000 Early Summer-run sockeye and 750,000 Summer-run sockeye are significantly below preseason expectations of 690,000 and 3,369,000, respectively.  The limited amount of TAC remaining is required for First Nations food, social and ceremonial purposes.   

The Departments first priority is to ensure that there is sufficient sockeye escapement to the spawning grounds for conservation purposes.  The Department is also committed to providing top priority, after conservation, to First Nations fishing for food, social and ceremonial purposes. 

Despite a no fishing for sockeye regulation for the sport fishery, DFO continued to observe and receive reports that sockeye were being encountered in the recreational fishery.

DFO is implementing this salmon closure in the recreational fishery to ensure the above priorities are provided.  This salmon closure will be reviewed weekly.

Recreational fishing opportunities for trout, steelhead and sturgeon and other non-salmon species remain open.

Variation order 2007-305 is in effect.

Notes:

Did you witness suspicious fishing activity or a violation?  If so, please call the Fisheries and Ocean Canada 24-hour toll free Observe, Record, Report line at (800) 465-4336.

For the 24 hour recorded opening and closure line, call toll free at (866) 431-FISH.

dennisK

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Re: Fraser Closing ???
« Reply #46 on: August 17, 2007, 12:36:25 PM »



Recreational fishing opportunities for trout, steelhead and sturgeon and other non-salmon species remain open.


Woohoo.

Can you bottom bounce for sturgeon?
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Zpg

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Re: Fraser Closing ???
« Reply #47 on: August 17, 2007, 12:38:14 PM »

That's ok.  I have a couple nice little spots picked out on the lower for pinks.  Haven't been to the upper for almost 2 months, cost to much for gas.  I would rather drive 5 min to the lower and get me some nice fresh pinks, hopefully they will start showing up in numbers soon. Then out for early Coho, I heard that we are supposed to have a bit of a rebound year for Coho, is this true? :)

I have heard the same and if the numbers that were and are still showing on the west side of VA are any indication then it should be a decent year....we can only hope!
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allwaysfishin

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Re: Fraser Closing ???
« Reply #48 on: August 17, 2007, 12:42:30 PM »

I've stated this fact over the past years but i'll repeat it.
I used to have close ties to the cheam through friends who are band members and are relatives of the former chief of the cheam. I, for several years had a letter of passage from band council to acces thier land for hunting and fishing privleges. I am also a member of B.C.' s METIS NATION.
My friend was the bands fishery manager for many years until about 4 years ago when he just had enough. The tradition among first nations is that only certain families have traditional fishing grounds. My friends was saddle rock area. What he saw happening was that any F.N. with ties to the band were arriving on the reserve lands during the sockeye migration and declaring thier right to fish. Do you all know that the government are the ones who pay for thier boats, thier nets, thier boots, thier gloves..... every single part of thier fishery is subsidized by both the provincial and federal governments. Then these "stewards" of the resource turn around and sell thier catch for TAX FREE $$$$

I have personally witnessed on numerous occasions, the drift netting AT NIGHT with nets tied together to achieve a BANK TO BANK drift. NOTHING GETS BY THAT and I guarantee that this is happening again this season.
An important thing to remember here is that it is not just us sporties who are crying foul over this issue of the cheam and sto lo nations over fishing the resource. First Nations groups from far up the fraser hate the cheam as well and if this was a hundred or so years ago..... there would be war over it.
It's not just an issue of fish either. There are other first nations groups that practice the same disregard when it comes to hunting big game. I have photos of 53 deer of all ages and both sexes, harvested at night with the use of military rados, and spotlight equiped motor bikes, atv's and 4x4's. The gunshots started at dusk and did not stop throughout the night. Also any hunters ever wonder why they closed the doe draws for the lower mainland of region 2??? Because the natives did nothing but ride around at night and shoot everything in sight. Anyone who hunts the harrison valley east road will know what i'm talking about.

The thing is this.... there is simply nothing u sporties can do to curb F.N. behavior by ranting off on the internet, this lies soley in government hands.
My advice to you is ORGANIZE AND QUIT BICKERING, rodneys been preachin that throughout. ORGANIZE or SHUT THE HELL UP.
Do what the saskatchewan farmers did. Gather in a group and head to victoria, call the news, and make a big stink.... take your tents, a weeks worth of food and necessities and STAND UP AND BE HEARD. If you are not prepared to do that..... than for the love of god..... shut the F*** up.

With that, I off to Nootka, where the F.N's are real nice, there's LOTS of fish to be had for everyone...... and you don't have to floss em :D
« Last Edit: August 17, 2007, 01:01:51 PM by allwaysfishin »
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Nicole

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Re: Fraser Closing ???
« Reply #49 on: August 17, 2007, 02:14:41 PM »

Another article...


http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/story/RTGAM.20070817.wsockeye0817/BNStory/National/home

Harvest of Fraser sockeye curtailed
Canadian Press

August 17, 2007 at 4:37 PM EDT

Victoria — The collapse of this summer's sockeye run on the largest salmon-producing river system in the world means no commercial or recreational fishing of the fish and seriously curtailed access for First Nations.

But a senior official with Fisheries and Oceans Canada is confident there will be enough sockeye entering British Columbia's Fraser River to ensure good spawning, which is the bottom line.

And while no sockeye are being pulled from the Fraser for sale to the public, there are still millions returning to other parts of the Pacific Coast to ensure that grocery stores and restaurants will still have sockeye for sale, albeit fewer and more expensive.

The forecast had been for 6.3 million sockeye to swim up the Fraser River from the Pacific this year, but the bottom has fallen out of that prediction.

Based on test fishing and monitoring, Fisheries has revised that forecast steeply down to just 1.6 million sockeye.

“At that level, there is not enough for commercial fisheries or recreational fisheries and there's not enough to meet all First Nations needs,” said Paul Ryall, who leads the salmon team at Fisheries and chairs the Fraser River Panel, the management mechanism under the Pacific Salmon Treaty with the United States.

In a normal year, about one million Fraser River sockeye would be earmarked for food, social and ceremonial use by First Nations.

As of mid-August, Mr. Ryall said about 100,000 sockeye had been taken by aboriginal fishermen and there may be a chance twice that number could be allocated.

“We think that we could harvest safely about 150,000 to 200,000 at the current run size, so there would be the ability to have some [further] very limited harvest for First Nations only,” he said.

In the international, multi-jursdictional world of salmon management on the Fraser, the Number One priority is conservation and the need to get enough fish back to the spawning grounds to produce future generations.

Next in line comes the obligation to First Nations. Commercial and recreational fisheries rank at the bottom.

According to the Sto:Lo Tribal Council, the limited harvest is creating hardship for all the First Nations of the Fraser and there are concerns there may not be enough sockeye to feed elders and families this winter.

“Frankly, I've not seen a summer such as this in 40 years,” said Grand Chief Ron John in a letter to Fisheries on Aug. 16.

The Sto:Lo have complained recreational fishermen on the Fraser are taking untold numbers of sockeye.

They accused Fisheries of allowing the Fraser River sport fishery to become “a macabre and destructive force” and have called on the department to close down the sport fishery.

Late this week, authorities made the decision to shut down a 40-kilometre stretch of the lower Fraser, from Mission Bridge to Hope, to all recreational salmon fishing, effective 12:01 a.m. Aug. 20.

The move is designed to eliminate the number of sockeye inadvertantly snared by sport fishermen.

Mel Kotyk, Fisheries' acting area director for the lower Fraser, said First Nations leaders were generally pleased with move, but in a teleconference call made it clear they thought the sport closure should have covered a larger area of the river and its ocean approaches.

“They like the direction, but they felt it should have gone further,” Mr. Kotyk said Friday.

Commercial fishermen, who rely on sockeye as their “money” fish, are also worried.

“It's devastating for those who just fish in the south and don't have licences to fish other parts of the coast,” said Irvin Figg, president of the United Fishermen and Allied Workers union, now a part of the autoworkers' union.

He estimated up to 600 fishermen may be affected.

“For them, the season's just going to be a write off.”

He said commercial harvest of sockeye was also banned by Fisheries for conservation reasons in 2005, despite an unprecedented return of what is known as the Horsefly run.

The collapse of the 2007 sockeye is being largely blamed on poor survival in the ocean of fish that migrated to the Pacific two years ago.

“The ocean in 2005 was quite warm,” said Mr. Ryall. “That's not a good condition for production of food to make these fish survive and grow.”

He said that theory is supported by the low number of Fraser River coho salmon returning this year after they, too, migrated to the ocean in 2005 and the relatively strong return of sockeye from the Harrison Lake area.

The Harrison Lake sockeye migrated to the ocean a year before the majority of sockeye from other parts of the Fraser system.

While other Pacific rivers are showing lower than forecast sockeye returns, they are not seeing the extremely low numbers in the Fraser.

Mr. Ryall said nearly 500,000 Skeena River sockeye have been taken commercially and Alaska is also allowing openings for sockeye.

In fact, according to Mr. Figg, the Americans are doing extremely well.

“Alaskan sockeye is coming back like gangbusters,” said Mr. Figg, prompting him to question the Canadian estimates.

“Our sockeye and their sockeye all go out into the Pacific and feed in the same spot.”

But Mr. Ryall noted all is not lost for commercial and recreational salmon fishing on the river this year.

“There will be pink salmon returning in sizable numbers and there's definitely interest, commercially,” said Mr. Ryall.

“Later in the fall there will be chum salmon, with both commercial and First Nations interest. And there has been some chinook fishing in the spring and it will continue into the fall and throughout the winter in very limited fashion.”

“So there is still going to be some salmon fishing, just no sockeye,” he said.

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glog

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Re: Fraser Closing ???
« Reply #50 on: August 17, 2007, 02:32:57 PM »

This is what i hate about the special interest groups and others with their bs, exaggerations and blatant lies.

here's some interesting points from the article.

1. The Sto:Lo have complained recreational fishermen on the Fraser are taking untold numbers of sockeye.They accused Fisheries of allowing the Fraser River sport fishery to become “a macabre and destructive force” and have called on the department to close down the sport fishery

how he gets away with such a statement i have no Idea!! Given the amount of illegal nets that they put in the river. All blatant lies and exaggerations in order to support their agenda which is a native only fishery!!! and congratulations to all those guys ranting and rving playing right into their hands.

2.In fact, according to Mr. Figg, the Americans are doing extremely well.

“Alaskan sockeye is coming back like gangbusters,” said Mr. Figg, prompting him to question the Canadian estimates.

“Our sockeye and their sockeye all go out into the Pacific and feed in the same spot


surprise, alaskans having another bumper year. I think its time to do some DNA analysis on those alaskan fish caught in the ocean, any bets thats were BC's missing fish are!!

I agree with alway... a lot of the bands I run into are fine and very amicable but these radicals are going to cause a lot of trouble unless they are dealt with by all involved!


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Steelhawk

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Re: Fraser Closing ???
« Reply #51 on: August 17, 2007, 02:42:02 PM »

Yah can't blame BBing for this, the natives would have pressured government regardless of method... Even if everyone of us was barfishing. 

The fact that we were fishing at all is more of the issue... And  now whatever FN caught doing it shall be called a hypocrite... There have been 35,000 sockeye caught already, and the fact they want us off the river makes me think we should all be going for regular boat rides, and document all the nets that will be drift netting over the bars we would normally be fishing...

I personally think that court is no longer the answer... That's a waste of time.

We need to be more guerilla in our tactics to ensure those who sell their catch PAY.

Cheers,
Nicole



Glad to hear you agreeing with me once in a while Nicole. I have urged those bfers who are not willing to confront bbers with a 50 to 1 ratio, to just cut lose some illegal nets out there. This will save much more socs.   ;D
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Nicole

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Re: Fraser Closing ???
« Reply #52 on: August 17, 2007, 03:11:11 PM »

Steelhawk, gotta give you something once in awhile ;)

The fact of the matter is there were plenty of fish on the spawning grounds in 2003, so overfishing could have only happened out in the chuck recently...

Or the predation has decimated the stocks on their way up to the north pacific feeding grounds...

The fact is that no one should be fishing right now.

This should be seen by all groups as a crisis...

The fact that natives are still fishing is what's bothering me, the fact that the river is closed to sporties does not bother me at all. We're doing our part...

And yet much of the media is saying that the native fisheries are closed along with everything else...

Nothing but lies, resulting in a misinformed public.

Cheers,
Nicole
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allwaysfishin

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Re: Fraser Closing ???
« Reply #53 on: August 17, 2007, 04:19:55 PM »

DFO knew this was coming.... this disasterously low return

if you can handle reading through several pages of document.... head over to the DFO pacific region website and on the main page, find the heading "state of the pacific ocean" and you will come to "some" understanding of all the influences affecting sockeye and many other oceanic species. And how oceanic temperatures are affecting ALL species. This read really opened my eyes.
I'd post a link but...... I ain't that computer savvy

Harvest of sockeye should be closed to EVERYONE period. This is way bigger than the "us sporties aren't getting a fair shake mentality" that so many of you are flogging. Sockeye may be on the verge of extinction in the fraser system what will YOU do about that today.... blame BB'ers ?? that's just ludicrous. CLOSE it down to ALL user groups period... and that is where ALL of should be putting our energies.

With that, I'm gonna try and stay clear of these posts......
in 48 hours i'll be floating in a boat far from this fraser river cluster f***

But , if someone can manage to organize ALL the sporties into a MOB of people heading for Victoria.... I'll stand ahead of you all and bring my metis flag..... not all injuns are out to screw the sporties... and i know lots who would march on over there with you.
good luck with all this people.... conservation is MUCH more imortant than slamming your fellow fisherman because of this river closure... how many of you would be right in there should they decide to open it up...... too embarrassed to say??? That's what i thought.
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Xgolfman

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Re: Fraser Closing ???
« Reply #54 on: August 17, 2007, 05:09:22 PM »

I've stated this fact over the past years but i'll repeat it.
I used to have close ties to the cheam through friends who are band members and are relatives of the former chief of the cheam. I, for several years had a letter of passage from band council to acces thier land for hunting and fishing privleges. I am also a member of B.C.' s METIS NATION.
My friend was the bands fishery manager for many years until about 4 years ago when he just had enough. The tradition among first nations is that only certain families have traditional fishing grounds. My friends was saddle rock area. What he saw happening was that any F.N. with ties to the band were arriving on the reserve lands during the sockeye migration and declaring thier right to fish. Do you all know that the government are the ones who pay for thier boats, thier nets, thier boots, thier gloves..... every single part of thier fishery is subsidized by both the provincial and federal governments. Then these "stewards" of the resource turn around and sell thier catch for TAX FREE $$$$

I have personally witnessed on numerous occasions, the drift netting AT NIGHT with nets tied together to achieve a BANK TO BANK drift. NOTHING GETS BY THAT and I guarantee that this is happening again this season.
An important thing to remember here is that it is not just us sporties who are crying foul over this issue of the cheam and sto lo nations over fishing the resource. First Nations groups from far up the fraser hate the cheam as well and if this was a hundred or so years ago..... there would be war over it.
It's not just an issue of fish either. There are other first nations groups that practice the same disregard when it comes to hunting big game. I have photos of 53 deer of all ages and both sexes, harvested at night with the use of military rados, and spotlight equiped motor bikes, atv's and 4x4's. The gunshots started at dusk and did not stop throughout the night. Also any hunters ever wonder why they closed the doe draws for the lower mainland of region 2??? Because the natives did nothing but ride around at night and shoot everything in sight. Anyone who hunts the harrison valley east road will know what i'm talking about.

The thing is this.... there is simply nothing u sporties can do to curb F.N. behavior by ranting off on the internet, this lies soley in government hands.
My advice to you is ORGANIZE AND QUIT BICKERING, rodneys been preachin that throughout. ORGANIZE or SHUT THE HELL UP.
Do what the saskatchewan farmers did. Gather in a group and head to victoria, call the news, and make a big stink.... take your tents, a weeks worth of food and necessities and STAND UP AND BE HEARD. If you are not prepared to do that..... than for the love of god..... shut the F*** up.

With that, I off to Nootka, where the F.N's are real nice, there's LOTS of fish to be had for everyone...... and you don't have to floss em :D

Excellent post...100% agree...

Something else you should all realize is the difference between Canada and alaska is alaska fisheries hired an independent biologist...They study what the fishing runs are doing and only fish the ones that are healthy...They have asked Canada to join them but have been refused because your DFO is run by fools in Ottawa....Many times they have warned that certain fisheries need to be closed etc. but it's fallen on deaf ears...Whatever their biologists say goes...It's sad when the ones in B.C. are screaming and end up resigning but still nothing happens..

hotrod

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Re: Fraser Closing ???
« Reply #55 on: August 17, 2007, 09:57:33 PM »

so be it....maybe now all the whining and bickering will stop.

as for first nations...if they really are the champions of our resources then they should comply with DFO.....if DFO decides to exclude them from the ban, then it only confirms their lack of commitment and their own spineless, stupidity.

me....i'm going to renew my tidal license and get re-familiarized with the chuck once again.

 I believe it was the spineless stupid gov't officials who mismanaged the fishery................Oh my god what colour are they !   Gimme a break with the redneckism!


   Hotrod
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DragonSpeed

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Thread closed.
« Reply #56 on: August 17, 2007, 11:08:23 PM »

And with the deletion of a number of posts, this now comes to a screeching halt.

AGAIN.