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[chris gadsden]

Wrong on a number of fronts. The ad hoc committee does not oppose gravel extraction as long as it is done in a responsible manner and from what I read on another forum it was not done in a responsible environmental manner at all. That was stated by someone that was there.

It has been unbelievable how hard it has to get the information on pre and post extraction engineering studies, it sort of makes one start to believe they may not have been done.

The whole thing from what I gather has not been transparent at all and you get told check with FOC, Solicitor General office, then MOE , Seabird FN and around and round it goes. The good thing about this petition should be that everything will be made available. They say it was too cost around $550,000 to build the bridge but because pressure was put on by the ad hoc committee they increased the lenght to prevent dewatering, it will be interesting when the final cost comes in but I believe that will be obtained by filing through the Freedom of Information. It yours and my taxpayers money too.

 

Local MLAs defend gravel removal
By Robert Freeman - :CityChilliwack Progress - June 16, 2008

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Chilliwack MLAs John Les and Barry Penner are standing by the provincial government’s claim that removing gravel from the Fraser River reduces the risk of flooding.


And Les said the removal of 400,000 cubic metres of gravel last year from a site near Agassiz is “one of the most responsible operations we’ve ever seen” in environmental terms.


Last week, an ad hoc committee of environmental groups asked the federal auditor-general to look into the flood protection claims used to justify the removal at Spring Bar, which they said “extensively damaged fish habitat with little or no gain to flood protection and erosion.”


But a senior federal fisheries official said that pink salmon numbers in the Fraser this year are actually up by 25 percent - 100 million more than the average 450 million - despite the claim of habitat damage.


However, committee members are saying the effects of the Spring Bar operation won’t be seen until the fall of 2009 when adult pinks are spawning in the area, or until the spring of 2010 when the fry are heading to the ocean.


This is the second petition sent to the auditor-general about gravel removal by largely the same B.C. environmental groups.


The David Suzuki Foundation, which signed the first petition in 2004, did not sign on this time, but not because of any disagreement, said spokesman John Werring.


“We’re 100 percent behind it,” he said, but “time constraints” prevented the foundation from signing on to the new petition.


He saw nothing wrong with filing a second petition, which along with other public complaints to the auditor-general, might finally bring about some changes.


“I hope so in the long run,” he said. “At what point do you stop pulling your hair out?”


But Les said he is “disappointed in the continued denial this (environmental) group seems to be in.”


“They simply will not - and aggressively will not - believe that gravel removal from the Fraser River is necessary ... and it puts us all at risk if we take that public policy option,” said the Chilliwack-Sumas MLA.


“They make much of the fact that this was the largest single removal in one location - does anybody stop to think there’s much less environmental damage than taking a little bit from all over the place?”


Les agreed the Spring Bar removal alone had little immediate effect on reducing flood risk.


“The key is this is something that needs to be done every year,” he said, in a number of locations. “Over time the river bottom will be lowered and there will be increased water-handling capability over the whole system.”


He said the provincial government has “bent over backwards” to balance flood protection “with environmental considerations” at Spring Bar and Harrison Bar and at several future locations.


But Les saw little chance of a “constructive dialogue” with the environmental groups as represented by the Fraser River Ad Hoc Stewardship Gravel Removal Committee.


“Their position is no gravel should be removed, and that’s where the disconnect is,” he said. “If we were to follow their advice, we’d be putting the population of certainly the Chilliwack area at long-term risk.”


Chilliwack-Kent MLA Barry Penner said a “managed program of responsibly removing gravel from the Fraser” was a promise that he and Les made in the last provincial election.


“Both John and I were very clear, if elected and our party formed government, we’d support the environmentally-responsible removal of gravel,” he said. “We’re keeping an election commitment.”


rfreeman@theprogress.com

 

[chris gadsden]

The file continues.


Deputy minister to meet on gravel issue
By Robert Freeman - Chilliwack Progress - July 03, 2008   
Environmental groups say they’ve run into a “stone wall of silence” in their efforts to work with the provincial government on a long-term strategy for gravel removal operations in the Fraser River.

“We have been trying to engage the government, particularly this provincial government ... and we’ve met with a stone wall of silence,” said John Werring, a biologist at the David Suzuki Foundation. “They do not want to talk about it.”

But yesterday, a ministry spokesperson said Solicitor-General John van Dongen has asked the deputy minister of Emergency Management BC to meet with Werring to discuss his concerns.

Werring was reacting to Chilliwack-Sumas MLA John Les’s suggestion that environmental groups are unalterably opposed to removing any gravel from the river, in spite of the flood protection benefits, so there’s little chance of holding a “constructive dialogue” with them.

“Their position is no gravel should be removed, and that’s where the disconnect is,” Les said in the earlier interview. Les headed the ministry that approves gravel removal operations until he stepped down as Solicitor-General in March.

Les said the environmentalists “simply will not – and aggressively will not – believe that gravel removal from the Fraser River is necessary” to reduce the risk of flooding.

But Werring said the groups that have formed the Fraser River Ad Hoc Stewardship Gravel Removal Committee are not opposed to gravel removal to reduce flood risk – but they do want input into a transparent approval process.

“We all acknowledge that gravel has to come out of the river,” he said, but the ministry won’t meet with the committee to discuss a long-term strategy for gravel removal.

Werring said the committee is also having difficulty getting information out of the ministry about the Spring Bar gravel removal operation earlier this year.

He said the committee was told to make a formal request under the Freedom of Information Act for engineering reports and for an estimate of the economic benefits of the removal, reported to be more than $1.6 million.

Last month, the committee asked the federal auditor-general to look into the Spring Bar removal operation. Up to 400,000 cubic metres of gravel was removed from the 10-hectare site near Seabird Island.

 

[marmot]

I know that "site near agassiz" that they are talking about....and if it was responsible, then why was there a light petroleum slick on the slough i was fishing down below it?  BULL$HIT.   

[chris gadsden]

I know that "site near agassiz" that they are talking about....and if it was responsible, then why was there a light petroleum slick on the slough i was fishing down below it?  BULL$HIT.   

From what I gather and was told it was from the tug that overturned when putting in the pilings.

[chris gadsden]

3 of us are meeting in Vancouver this week with the Provincial Solicitor General's people to discuss this mess.

Also we are working on a public information meeting in Chilliwack for this Fall.

[chris gadsden]

3 of us are meeting in Vancouver this week with the Provincial Solicitor General's people to discuss this mess.

Also we are working on a public information meeting in Chilliwack for this Fall.

Now we  are not as they cancelled out today for some lame excuse. They want us to meet in Victoria in August now. One can see they are trying to avoid a meeting at all costs, disappointing and one can apparently see they are trying to hide from us.

[chris gadsden]

3 of us are meeting in Vancouver this week with the Provincial Solicitor General's people to discuss this mess.

Also we are working on a public information meeting in Chilliwack for this Fall.

Now we  are not as they cancelled out today for some lame excuse. They want us to meet in Victoria in August now. One can see they are trying to avoid a meeting at all costs, disappointing and one can apparently see they are trying to hide from us.

They changed there mind again so two of us off to Victoria early tomorrow to meet with the Minister of Public Safety and Solicitor General John van Dongen staff to discuss this file. Darn no fishing but this actually is more important as we work to ensure these projects donot harm more fish habitat.

[chris gadsden]

Article re our meeting in Victoria.

Chilliwack Progress

Meeting eases gravel removal rift


By Robert Freeman - Chilliwack Progress

Published: July 31, 2008 6:00 PM
Updated: August 01, 2008 2:39 PM

Environmentalists are “cautiously optimistic” an end to the constant conflict over gravel removal in the Fraser River is in sight after a meeting Monday with the associate deputy minister of the Public Safety Ministry.

“At this point we’re cautiously optimistic the government is listening to some of our concerns and they seem to be moving in a direction that might help in the conflict on the Fraser River,” said biologist John Werring.

He and Chris Gadsden, a local member of an ad hoc committee of environmentalists, met with associate deputy minister Wes Shoemaker in Victoria on Monday.

Shoemaker agreed the meeting was “very productive” and he’s confident gravel removal from the Fraser River for flood protection will become a routine matter without the conflict seen in past years.

“This is just part of the long-term and on-going strategy of protecting B.C. from the risk of flooding,” he said.

Shoemaker said he got the message “loud and clear” at the meeting that the committee is not opposed to all gravel removal.

Gadsden said he now believes the ministry is willing to be “more transparent” and provide the committee with information on flood protection benefits from proposed removal sites, and possible impacts on fish habitat.

But he and others say they are “very disappointed” that their local MLA, Barry Penner, who is also B.C.’s environment minister, won’t meet with members of the ad hoc committee.

Penner said yesterday he is willing to meet with committee members in the minister’s office in Victoria, but it’s only fair that local constituents get first dibs on his time in Chilliwack.

“At my constituency office I’m always anxious to meet with constituents,” he said. “That’s my priority right now.”

“I have a lengthy waiting list of people who want to come see me (in Chilliwack),” he added. “They get first draw on my time.”

Penner said he has agreed to meet with local members of the committee in Chilliwack, but to date those meetings haven’t happened because of conflicting schedules.

One of those local committee members, Gwyn Joiner, said he doesn’t understand why Penner won’t meet with the ad hoc committee, “which really knows what’s going on with this gravel issue” unlike himself.

Werring said he believes the ministry is willing to address the committee’s concerns about the way gravel is mined and provide information so the committee can comment on proposed removal sites.

“They don’t want to open up the decision-making process,” he said, but seemed willing to present information to committee members at a future meeting to hear their input.

He said if the ministry follows through on promises to share information on the impact of gravel mining on fish habitat at proposed removal sites, it “would go a long way to resolving the disputes.”

“But until we actually see what’s going on, we won’t know if they are doing what they say they are.”

Werring said the committee is not opposed to all gravel mining, but wants to be assured that the removal sites actually improve flood protection without doing significant harm to fish habitat.

Shoemaker said the ministry’s program aims to “balance fish values with public safety objectives.”

“We will continue to reach out to (all stakeholders) to talk about the program and share with them the many aspects of the science and site selection and those things that will be part of the program.”

Last month, the ad hoc committee asked the federal auditor-general to look into the government’s flood-proofing claims to justify approval of gravel mining in the Fraser River.

The request followed the largest removal operation ever approved by federal fisheries at Spring Bar near Seabird Island.

The Fraser River Ad Hoc Stewardship Gravel Removal Committee includes the B.C. Wildlife Federation, Fraser Valley Salmon Society, Sportfishing Defence Alliance, Fraser Valley Angling Guides Association, Chilliwack/Vedder River Cleanup Coalition and the Alouette River Management Society.

rfreeman@theprogress.com

[chris gadsden]

We, the Fraser River Gravel Ad Hoc Committee had our planning meeting today for our meeting with the Environment Minister Barry Penner that is to take place in Vancouver on Tuesday.

I certainly hope they will take our visit seriously and listen carefully to the concerns we have been presenting on how damaging some of these gravel excavations projects have been on fish and their habitat the last few years.

Of course we are not against responsible gravel removal but we feel in a lot of cases it has been just gravel for profit and the proper environmental studies have not been done because of political interference by some. Also the process has not been as transparent as it should be in an open government, a government that should provide answers when asked. This has been very difficult in many cases the last while, hopefully that will change for the good of the fish in the years ahead.

I believe we have a great presentation, we can only hope once again that they listen carefully to it.

[Nicole]

Watch John Les say that the gravel is for construction, and is quickly corrected by Barry Penner... What a whitewash!

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=NhbHEBzqmGA

John Les is a douche.
Nicole

[chris gadsden]

Video no longer avaaible they say, thats interesting.

It was there a couple of days ago.

[chris gadsden]

I am told it is there but some computers can not access it.

[Sam Salmon]

I am told it is there but some computers can not access it.

Sometime Youtube doesn't work too well with IE and will work OK with Firefox, I've also been told the opposite so it's best to switch up, the video is there but Youtube handles a lot of video so it's best to keep trying or come back a bit later.

[chris gadsden]

Chilliwack Progress

Input sought in Fraser gravel mining


By Robert Freeman - Chilliwack Progress

Published: October 06, 2008 6:00 PM

A public review of gravel mining sites in the Fraser River is one of the topics that members of an ad hoc environmental committee hope to raise during a meeting today (Tuesday) with B.C. Environment Minister Barry Penner.

“We want to get some transparency in the decision-making process,” committee member Marvin Rosenau said before the meeting, especially the reasons for the proposed removals.

“At this point in time, a lot of that stuff is done in camera,” he said, and what little information the committee has gleaned about past removals was obtained through freedom of information requests.

However, there is a “very transparent and very public” process around gravel removals from the Vedder River where a management advisory committee is in place.

“There’s lot of warts and bumps in the process, but the decision-making is pretty open and transparent,” Rosenau said.

Decisions made behind closed doors about Fraser River gravel removal has led to allegations of political interference and “gravel grabs” for profit, instead of flood protection.

In June, the ad hoc committee asked the federal auditor-general to look into the government’s flood-proofing claims to justify gravel mining approvals in the Fraser.

The request followed the largest removal operation ever approved by federal fisheries at Spring Bar near Seabird Island.

In July, ministry officials met with committee members, but Penner would only meet in his Victoria cabinet office, saying his time in his Chilliwack-Kent riding office was reserved for constituents.

Terry Bodman, a local member of the committee, said he’s hoping for a “positive” outcome from today’s meeting with Penner, which had taken “some time to arrange.”

“I’m looking forward to sitting down with the minister of the environment and working out some issues,” he said.

But he and Rosenau declined to comment on what the committee might do if the meeting with Penner does not produce that positive outcome.

“We’ll see what Barry has to say,” Rosenau said.

Rosenau confirmed again that the committee is not opposed to gravel removal “where it is clearly required” to prevent flooding or erosion, and where “reasonable alternatives are not available.”

But the committee wants to see the science behind any claims of flood protection benefits, he said.

Penner insisted the existing process is “open,” and that he is not aware of any problems the committee has encountered getting scientific information collected by the government before approving removal operations.

“They haven’t written to me to say that,” he said.

Penner refused to comment on whether he believes today’s meeting will have a positive outcome.

“We’ll see what they have to say,” he said. “That’s the purpose of the meeting, I guess.”

Penner and fellow MLA John Les have both stated that their support of “environmentally responsible” gravel removal to protect residents from flood hazards is an election promise they aim to keep.

The Fraser River Ad Hoc Stewardship Gravel Removal Committee includes the B.C. Wildlife Federation, Fraser Valley Salmon Society, Sportfishing Defence Alliance, Fraser Valley Angling Guides Association, Chilliwack/Vedder River Cleanup Coalition and the Alouette River Management Society.

rfreeman@theprogress.com

[chris gadsden]

This surfaced while we were at the meeting today, interesting.

Chilliwack Progress

NDP charge Penner 'muzzled' scientists


By Robert Freeman - Chilliwack Progress

Published: October 07, 2008 5:00 PM
Updated: October 07, 2008 5:15 PM

BC New Democrats say they have a letter that shows Environment Minister Barry Penner tried to "muzzle" two government scientists who raised concerns in 2003 about gravel mining in the Fraser River.

"It appears that the very MLA who is now the environment minister put political pressure onto the highest levels of the civil service in an attempt to get scientists to defy the government's own moratorium on gravel dredging," NDP environment critic Shane Simpson said in a news release.

The NDP release was issued just as Penner met with members of environmental groups seeking to open the government's decision-making process in approving gravel removals to public review.

The 45-minute meeting in Vancouver ended with no clear path to an agreement.

"I"m not unhappy with the meeting, but I thought there would be more of a meeting of the minds," committee member Terry Bodman said. "There was no meeting of the minds."

Penner was not available for comment.

In the Jan. 29 letter released by the NDP, MLA Penner wrote that he is "increasingly concerned" by reports that two employees in the ministry of water, land and air protection are "suggesting it is BC government policy not to support the removal of gravel from the Fraser River."

"I understand this to be in direct conflict with government policy and will be happy to supply you with more specific information," he wrote.

After asking the deputy minister to confirm the policy of "responsible" gravel removal, Penner added, "If the answer is yes, I think it would be worthwhile to remind your ministry's employees of this policy as well."

The release of the letter comes just days after former government biologist Marvin Rosenau told the media that he was muzzled by east Fraser Valley MLAs for speaking out against a massive housing development in Mission.

The NDP is asking Auditor General John Doyle to review the conduct of Penner, MLA Randy Hawes, MLA John Les and Premier Gordon Campbell for alleged "interference" in the discipline and removal of ministry staff.

The NDP also want the auditor general to investigate the Rosenau case "and "the climate of fear created by the Campbell government in the environmental assessment process."

Rosenau attended yesterday's meeting with Penner, but said he was not aware of the NDP news release.