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Author Topic: Chilliwack River Valley Is A Disaster Area.  (Read 51863 times)

chris gadsden

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Re: Chilliwack River Valley Is A Disaster Area.
« Reply #45 on: May 26, 2008, 10:28:19 PM »


Here is the article.

Warmth brings out rowdies
Police chopper needed to help break up crowd
Kent Spencer, The Province
Published: Monday, May 26, 2008

The summer season started inauspiciously on English Bay beach on the weekend with 100 intoxicated youths releasing pepper-spray into a crowd.

Police said a helicopter was needed to help disperse 1,500 to 2,000 unruly people, who had gathered to enjoy the year's first warm Saturday night.

With the helicopter shining a powerful light overhead, and officers deployed on the ground, English Bay beach was closed for the night. The beach is one of the region's top tourist attractions.



Brent Ganby, president of the West End Residents Association, blames weekend violence and drunkenness at English Bay on outsiders coming to Vancouver for a good time.
"In order to deal with disruption, we requested the assistance of the [police helicopter]," said Insp. Ted Schinbein yesterday. "It provided illumination and we were able to move people off the beach.

"We had a very busy night in the downtown core, from late in the evening until early in the morning."

Parks board commissioner Allan de Genova said it's "a bit sad" a helicopter was needed to "disperse rowdy people."

"We're going to have to crack down very hard. This sends the wrong message to families who use the beach. There will be zero tolerance. Re-offenders will not be happy campers," said de Genova, who is running for the Vision party's mayoral nomination.

Schinbein said there was a stabbing, three gun-related calls and seven to 10 disturbances from groups of people fighting.

At 10:15 p.m., about 100 "intoxicated fighting youths" were squirting pepper spray into a crowd on the beach in the 1700-block Beach Avenue. Police eventually got them to leave.

The stabbing occurred at 8:10 p.m. Saturday, when two men got into an altercation in the 700-block Beach Avenue. Both had been drinking.

Police, who have a videotape of the incident from a witness, say the victim's throat was slashed by a knife. His injuries are not life-threatening. The suspect, who is in custody, is expected to be charged.

Brent Granby, president of the West End Residents Association, believes the beaches are safe.

"I don't think there is an unsafe environment," he said. "It is not a dangerous place to go."

Granby blames outsiders who come to Vancouver looking for a good time.

"So many people come into the city from outlying areas. It's a challenge for Vancouver police. It speaks to the necessity of a regional police force. There's no way Vancouver taxpayers can bear the responsibility of this kind of policing needs," he said.

"Last night was the first warm Saturday night in a long, cold, wet spring," Granby said. "A lot of people came by bus to English Bay. Davie Street was bustling."

De Genova said the VPD's four-person beach patrol has already confiscated large quantities of liquor so far this season.

"We do not condone alcohol or illicit drug use on any beach," said de Genova. "The beach patrol is back but police are stretched a bit. What took place is unfortunate. People should bring soft drinks to the beach and leave their alcohol at home."spencer@png.canwest.com

 

© The Vancouver Province 2008

dennyman

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Re: Chilliwack River Valley Is A Disaster Area.
« Reply #46 on: May 26, 2008, 10:50:23 PM »

With regards to the incident at Engiish Bay, sounds like the individuals at the Vancouver Parks Board will be taking a zero tolerance stand towards the drinking of alcohol or illicit drug use at any of the public beaches in Vancouver. Makes sense to me, for if you wish to have a good time at the beach or in the great outdoors leave the drugs and booze at home.
Be interesting to see if Cultus Lake will follow suit with a zero tolerance towards drugs and liquor.
And even though it would be initially unpopular, they should only allow day use sites on the land above the Tamahi Falls. Camping would only be allowed at provincial or private campsites.  Any other forms of camping should not be allowed.
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chris gadsden

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Re: Chilliwack River Valley Is A Disaster Area.
« Reply #47 on: May 27, 2008, 11:19:04 AM »

Chamber calls for campsite increase
Paul J. Henderson, The Times
Published: Tuesday, May 27, 2008

After a long weekend that saw the usual throng of illegal campers in the Chilliwack River Valley, it may come as little surprise that campsites in the province have been on the decline for a few years.

In a move to stem the loss of campgrounds across B.C., the B.C. Chamber of Commerce passed a resolution to encourage a 25 per cent increase in the number of campgrounds at their annual annual general meeting held in Whistler last week.

While tourism is one of the largest sectors of the B.C. economy, the number of campsites declined by 4,759, or 10.54 per cent, between 2005 to 2007, according to numbers from Tourism British Columbia.

Over that period of time 74 campgrounds closed, including public and private facilities.

"It sparked a lot of discussion at the AGM," said Jeremy Sibley, president of the Chilliwack Chamber of Commerce.

"The tack we are taking is from the business perspective, for the money that campers and recreational users bring to communities."

Sibley said even some individuals who represent the hotel industry supported the resolution because, contrary to intuition, increased camping can even help the hotel business as a result of spin-offs.

Every year the B.C. Chamber of Commerce sends out a policy manual to various levels of government to address a whole host of issues that affect business in the province.

The resolution on campsites recommended a goal to increase campsites and lodging spaces by 25 per cent over the next five years, and to identify suitable Crown land for campsite and recreational vehicle (RV) development.

Currently there are 936 private campgrounds that provide tenting and RV accommodations with 44,481 sites available in the province. There are also 340 provincial park campgrounds with 11,125 sites.

The chamber resolution stated that visitors from other provinces and the U.S. are no longer provided with enough facilities to encourage return visits.

"The B.C. Provincial Government has stated they would like to double tourism by 2015--this cannot happen with diminishing accommodations in rural regions," the resolution stated.

Environment Minister Barry Penner did not get back to the Times before going to press.

 

© Chilliwack Times 2008

troutbreath

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Re: Chilliwack River Valley Is A Disaster Area.
« Reply #48 on: May 27, 2008, 03:57:09 PM »

They use to put roadblocks up a lot of the logging/secondary roads and nab the worst of them before they got to the forrest service campsites. I don't think having pay only camping is the answer to anything. As they would do like they do at English Bay just show up and party without camping. If you don't have some sort of enforcement your going to get these losers showing up every summer leaving there garbage destroying property and environment in their drunken meth induced delirium. It's only gotten worse because they know there is nothing stopping them. Even when it warms up a bit they will come a floating down the Vedder leaving empties, KFC, and garbage behind because they know there is no one to fine them under the age old law of littering, public drunkenness etc. I use to get stopped going into the back country in the summer by the RCMP to check for open alcohol and firearms etc. Not much of that anymore. :-\

Why would tourists want to come here and be assaulted by drunken thugs because we have a lack of enforcement. If you call into the RCMP now and say that you were threatened by drunken rowdies while camping, I doubt they would make it there that day if at all. Low on the priority list. Those people who collect fees from the once free forrest service campgrounds are not around when trouble starts and not likely to do anything as they would get beaten too. It's best handled by the police anyway.
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another SLICE of dirty fish perhaps?

Xgolfman

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Re: Chilliwack River Valley Is A Disaster Area.
« Reply #49 on: May 27, 2008, 05:41:08 PM »

If the powers that be said you can only camp in designated campsites along the river and no where else then you could open more parks etc..If you were camping in one of these sites and paying for it you would be allot less tolerant of drunks etc and in kind they would be forced to leave or learn to behave...BUT when they can camp anywhere they please, chop down trees and act like total a$$holes without repercussions then why would they?
Only camping on the Vedder should be in designated sites period...Make trouble, go to jail and get heavy fines..Alternatives to paying for your fines...Vedder river clean ups mandatory...get your ticket signed AFTER the cleanup and be monitored by the directors..would love to know how these losers would feel after doing a few cleanups about trashing the river again?

bentrod

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Re: Chilliwack River Valley Is A Disaster Area.
« Reply #50 on: May 28, 2008, 08:44:03 PM »

I recently contacted the Mayor of Chilliwack, The honorable Clint Hames.  Here's what he had to say about the issue:

Thank you for the e-mail.  Even though the area you speak of is not technically in the city, we do care deeply about the destruction of the area and the disturbing trend of theft from vehicles. 

There are several challenges to protecting this area.  Firstly, the area is Provincial Crown land.  This means that everyone, including people who are homeless and use theft as a means of survival, can “camp” in the area.  We have tried very hard over the past several years to have the area declared a recreation management area, a park or anything to allow the regulation of uses in the Chilliwack River Valley.  To date, we have been unsuccessful in bringing about significant change.

As such, we rely on too few Conservation Officers and too few Provincially assigned police to patrol the area.  You would be interested to know that the area sees nearly a million external visitors a year.  I would encourage you to write to the Minister of the Environment and urge more protection for the Valley.


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VAGAbond

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Re: Chilliwack River Valley Is A Disaster Area.
« Reply #51 on: May 29, 2008, 12:25:41 PM »

Most of the stuff in Rodney's pictures is bags of garbage or far larger piles than any group of campers would produce.    Sloppy campers don't bag their garbage or pile it up before leaving it.   That stuff is houeshold garbage delivered to the bush by local residents.  Solution:  Make the landfills free for small loads.
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Xgolfman

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Re: Chilliwack River Valley Is A Disaster Area.
« Reply #52 on: May 29, 2008, 03:00:40 PM »

Most of the stuff in Rodney's pictures is bags of garbage or far larger piles than any group of campers would produce.    Sloppy campers don't bag their garbage or pile it up before leaving it.   That stuff is houeshold garbage delivered to the bush by local residents.  Solution:  Make the landfills free for small loads.

Funny you should say that....I was walking out up by the upper gravel pit by the short pullout that is used as a dumping ground...A new toyota tacoma, grey , lifted and sporting a super fancy all chrome grill and front bumper light bar pulled in...A young guy and his girlfriend with a big box of trash had pulled in and up and were about to dump that out in the bush..We walked up the trail and caught um and they jumped back in their rig and took off..Think they could have afforded the dump but obviously why when the river is so easily used  Very sad!!!!

chris gadsden

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Re: Chilliwack River Valley Is A Disaster Area.
« Reply #53 on: May 29, 2008, 08:13:02 PM »

Most of the stuff in Rodney's pictures is bags of garbage or far larger piles than any group of campers would produce.    Sloppy campers don't bag their garbage or pile it up before leaving it.   That stuff is houeshold garbage delivered to the bush by local residents.  Solution:  Make the landfills free for small loads.
90% of what you saw in the pictures are from campers as I was there and took the pictures. Some of the campers most likely feel a little guilty so bag it in the hope someone or some group will pick it up for them and haul it away for them.

As well most of the camping areas I observed after the long weekend and for many other years have remnants of the camping trip scattered all around the immediate area.

However what you describe happens big time as well not only throughout the CRV but in any rural area and like Xgolfman described.
« Last Edit: May 29, 2008, 08:15:46 PM by chris gadsden »
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chris gadsden

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Re: Chilliwack River Valley Is A Disaster Area.
« Reply #54 on: June 06, 2008, 11:12:30 AM »


Today's Chilliwack Progress as Barry Penner wades in. Further comments are encourgaded, is education the real answer or not?


Education key to stopping illegal campers: Penner
By Jennifer Feinberg - Chilliwack Progress - June 05, 2008   

The rules making it illegal to park overnight and camp in the lower part of the Chilliwack River system are working well overall, according to Environment Minister Barry Penner.

“Some would say the simple answer is to hire more government staff to pick up litter and do enforcement,” he said, “but I’m not sure there’s any magic number that would accomplish the desired outcome of having people respect the environment.

“Ultimately it will take more of an education effort to fundamentally change people’s values.”

Different local groups and agencies have been assessing the results, in the wake of the first long weekend of the year in May. Most of the major camping messes and garbage dumping were discovered above the area covered by the rules.

“We certainly worked hard to get the Section 58 order in place (under the Forest and Range Practices Act) and the idea was to use it as a pilot project,” Penner explained.

Trying to stamp out irresponsible camping and

partying next to the pristine Chilliwack-Vedder River system, because of the possible harmful effects on fish and fish habitat were the rationale for the altered legislation in the first place, the local MLA said.

Penner contacted those mandated to coordinate it from the Ministry of Tourism, Sports and the Arts, and is awaiting their assessment of how things went during the Victoria Day long weekend.

“I wanted to hear from them how it’s working and whether they would support extending the enforcement area (above Tamihi) based on the performance to date,” Penner said.

He acknowledged there’s a “range of views” on the idea to expand the territory covered by the Section 58 order.

“Some say extend it, while others say it may have unintended consequences,” the local MLA added.

Citizens on Patrol coordinator Eileen Brader doesn’t think expanding the coverage area would ultimately do the trick.

“I don’t favour section 58 being expanded up to Chilliwack Lake,” she said.

“I feel it will just move the ‘bush campers’ further into the bush and that would make it more difficult to find them and way more dangerous as a fire potential. This is exactly what has happened with the current section 58.”

But she does favour the rules being expanded to cover the Slesse road area.

“It seems to have been left out of the loop down there.”

Certain areas should be transformed into a managed campsite, Brader said, such as the area known as The Cedars, as well as the Chipmunk caves and Larsons Holdings.

“The Bench Road and Chipmunk peninsular should be cleared out and either aggressively monitored or closed.

It has become a dangerous area with irresponsible recreational vehicle drivers.”

Penner said there are four Conservation Officers (COs) stationed in the Chilliwack areas, which “compares favourably” with the rest of the province.

“Other communities would love to have that many,” he stressed.

One of the biggest challenges for the Chilliwack River Valley is that no one agency can adequately police Chilliwack’s vast back country, he said.

“Ministry of the Environment does not have a budget that would allow more COs,” he said simply. “I don’t know if anyone has ideas as to where the extra funding would come from.”

It’s just not as simple as adding more staff.

“We could increase that number by 100 per cent and we still couldn’t be everywhere all the time.

“We rely on all our partner agencies to work together, like from the ministries of forestry and tourism, sports and the arts, as well as RCMP and FVRD, Citizens on Patrol, and First Nations.

The volunteer-driver COP would do more patrols if the group could get their hands on off-road vehicle.

“Our patrollers use their own vehicles, which are fine for the Chilliwack Lake Road, but we are limited in the amount of vehicles we have for logging road use and the wear and tear for regular patrols is expensive,” Brader said. “I also believe that we could do with some Forest Rangers patrolling the whole Valley over weekends, using forestry trucks and radio controlled not turfing campers out but checking to see if they are acting responsibly.

“People need to have fun and the valley is a recreational area.”

But it comes down to a few ruining it for everyone else, she figures.

“Most bush campers, about 97 per cent I have met are good, responsible people, but it is the last three per cent that are spoiling it for everyone and it is this three per cent that needs to be dealt with.”

jfeinberg@theprogress.com


dennisK

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Re: Chilliwack River Valley Is A Disaster Area.
« Reply #55 on: June 09, 2008, 08:58:06 AM »

can't we leave chicken bones or prawn shells or something creative (non destructive) in popular areas to stink them up so the campers stay away?
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chris gadsden

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Re: Chilliwack River Valley Is A Disaster Area.
« Reply #56 on: June 09, 2008, 09:47:52 AM »

can't we leave chicken bones or prawn shells or something creative (non destructive) in popular areas to stink them up so the campers stay away?
I know a farmer who got so fed up by partiers that frequented an area by his place he eventually spread well cured cow manure there and that ended his problem. ;D ;D

Of course one does not want to spoil the camping experience for responsible people.

In respect to Mr Penner's remarks, education is always an important component to many facets of our life but we know without enforcement in our society things will get out of hand.

For example I remember reading a few years the police went on strike for a short time, in a community back East and the downtown turned into one big drag strip with cars exceeding the speed limit every where.

dennisK

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Re: Chilliwack River Valley Is A Disaster Area.
« Reply #57 on: June 09, 2008, 10:07:37 AM »

can't we leave chicken bones or prawn shells or something creative (non destructive) in popular areas to stink them up so the campers stay away?
I know a farmer who got so fed up by partiers that frequented an area by his place he eventually spread well cured cow manure there and that ended his problem. ;D ;D



actually a good idea...lots of other places "good campers" can go camp :)

let's retake the river...
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marmot

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Re: Chilliwack River Valley Is A Disaster Area.
« Reply #58 on: June 09, 2008, 07:59:59 PM »

Our police and legal system in general is like an old tired dog with no teeth.  We need a new dog with sharp teeth to put a little fear into the eyes of criminals.  Right now it is a joke, people know that for "minor" offences....*if* they get caught that nothing is going to come of it.  It wont change and people will continue to get frustrated as long as BC stays so lenient and liberal when it comes to crime and punishment.  The problem to me is a political one, and we all know how long that takes to change.

The fireworks here in van....or I should say the "rowdies" at the fireworks every year are a good example of our province's complete lack of balls, and tact, when it comes to dealing with this sort of crime.  Fines mean squat.  It is disconnected from the event.  Drinking on the beach and get caught?  Guess what, you get to clean up the beach for a day every weekend, ALL summer.  Litter while camping? Same thing.  You're on cleanup duty or beautifying/landscaping parks.  Don't think the rules apply to you and you dont have to do that work?  Go to jail.  Stupid people have it way too easy right now.
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chris gadsden

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Re: Chilliwack River Valley Is A Disaster Area.
« Reply #59 on: March 13, 2014, 02:38:36 PM »

With our 41st cleanup not far away, April 12th I thought I would post what we continue to deal with.

More info on the Chilliwack Vedder River Cleanup Society is at www.cleanrivers.ca