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[aquaholic]

Can't judge people by there gear, I know a couple people who fish with spinning reels and they are good rods, there is also many Old timers with cheap gear that fish ethicly that out fish many guys with sims waders,sage rods,milner pins etc etc

Its all in what you can afford to fish with, cheap gear doesnt mean my smelly socks

[aquaholic]

Everybody knows BB is snag fish,snag fish is illegal.but BB is legal.I am so confused.

Bottom Boucning and Flossing are 2 completely different things

[jetboatjim]

Guys, it's time some of you realized that most of the pre-spawning salmon caught in the rivers are lined, or flossed - intentionally or not.
If you think you are catching them because they consistently bite, you are simply deluding yourselves.
Yes, there is the occasional 'aggression strike' (especially with coho and spring jacks) that ends up with you hooking the fish INSIDE the mouth, but other than that, take a close look at the position of your hook every time you bring in the fish.
Is the point of the hook inside the mouth? If not, the fish is probably lined.

Even short-floating is conducive to snagging if you run your presentation through a thick school of fish. That's why I am done with the Vedder until some heavy rain blows the river and cleans it of pinks.

If you don't believe me, try fishing with circle hooks: then tell me how many fish you caught.

so fishing a hole that is 6 feet deep, and using gear that fishes 3-4 feet deep flosses fish ? just because you hook a fish in the corner of the mouth , or the hook is facing the wrong way does not mean you sangged that fish. I have witnessed hundreds of "takes" (actually seeing them eat it) from fish and you would be suprised the distance they will move for an offering, and how they end up getting hooked.

[YESFISH]

Its nice to be honest and a honest fisherman. Please don't misunderstand.....................
I treat everyone fairly but I've seen so much prejudice in Canada that its amazing. I will welcome you I like fishing room. We walk to avoid it but no one should fish within a poles reach of each other. The river is large. I've had groups of people (all nationalities) who have tried to get so close to annoy me so I will leave a hole. I've seen it both ways. You are refreshing and I'm glad you like fishing.

I'm from the US but own a Canadian home and I pay higher taxes and insurance but that is socialism. If a Canadian buys a home in the US, that won't happen.  Buying a BC home was my choice.  ALso, if I sell, 1/3 goes to your gov't.  There is more prejudice in Canada. Ours and the Canadian media have sabotaged what really occurs politically in the USA and that has hurt our relations.  Its similar to what is on the river. I'm from the US but Canadians and US people are to me, all Americans. Why am I called a Yankee?  Its OK, I like the country and its people.  I think you have more humor than the US.  I remind all the US people that we are visitors.  I also sway them away from knowing about the river.  I fear driving my own Washington state vehicle of fear of attacks.  I've lost over $3000 US in two vandals incidents toward my vehicle. I get annoyed with the prejudice and the people claiming they don't understand rules on the river. That irritates me. 

You've made a reminder of everyone treating each other fairly - which is good. If you correct those on the river, that is also good.
Hope to see you on the river. You can outfish me, I want get mad but I do ok too.

[dennyman]

Bottom bouncing with a short leader is not snagging.  There was an article on this I believe last year in  BC Outdoors magazine.  Some of the water you would want to do this on are the deep pools  to put your offering in front of the fish. However, if you bottom bounce with a long leader (eg.  five feet long or longer)  and put your line in low water runs overrun with pinks, then of course you are going to be snagging fish right and left. Time and place for everything in my opinion.

And Yes fish just saw your post. Wow, getting a bit off topic here but there is prejudice in both countries - yes. However, to say Canada is more prejudiced is a bit strong. For instance, when I lived in Calgary, and followed as a fan the football team there a lot of the black players were amazed at what a great place Canada was. Way less racial discrimination and many made the decision to become Canadian citizens and to live in Canada.  As far as taxes and housing. I think for the typical Canadian it is not that easy and for favourable tax treatment you are better off having a principal residence in Canada. If you are set on having a residence in the U.S. it is best to sit down with a knowledgeable U.S tax accountant to see if the numbers make sense. 

[obie1fish]

There are times when we see things that are not ethical, and when we try to follow the rules with little reward fishwise, it does burn my biscuits when I see someone who is obviously fishing illegally or unethically (don't assume that legal is ethical- that's a whole other thread!) who does get fish and seem proud of it.

Longer story shorter, there are times when I see someone fishing unethically and/or illegally and I am mistaken, and thank my lucky stars I kept my mouth shut because, as said earlier, when I took the time to watch, and I saw I was mistaken. The mutterings of others around me who I assume are knowledgeable (another mistake, we all know) can influence me, too. I don't need a mistaken situation to help me look foolish; I do that pretty good on my own. Asian, Slovakian, German, Scottish, WASP, Martian (or was that the peyote?), I've seen 'em all be unethical, but even more fishing ethically. As usual, it's when we feel we have a right to the fish, and not a right to the OPPORTUNITY to catch fish, that things get nasty.


That being said, a little patience and calm communication can go a long way. And if the person's reply to the civilized inquiry goes awry, then, well, there are alternatives.

[chris gadsden]

Bottom Boucning and Flossing are 2 completely different things

This has been said time after time but when you are fishing with a float your leader should be around 12 to 18 inches and your float should be sitting straight up at all times and not laying on its side or you will just be doing a form of flossing. Of course you adjust the depth you are fishing by adjusting the float to the depth of the run you are fishing. At all times let the line run free off your center pin, level wind or spinning reel and donot hold back. The exception would be if you are fishing a blade as you have to hold back some to make the blade work well.

With all the pinks in the river even when short floating you will hook up the odd time by a non biting fish but not that many. You must be careful when winding in across the masses of pinks along the slower parts of the runs. However when you see people hauling them in backwards time after time you know the method they are using is not the best way to be fishing to take a biting fish. Some will disagree I know but the best offering to use to take coho and chinooks is good bait. In certain areas a spoon or blade works well too but with so many pinks foul hooking is a problem. I know there is exceptions as fish will take a good wool tie or fly but still bait is the best offering to use, just ask The Master, thats why he uses it most of the time at this time of year.

Unfortunately there is a very high percentage of snagging going on once again this year and I am sure all readers of this form have seen it first hand. As well no one race has a monoply over the snagging and flossing of fish as we all see it every day when on the Chillwack Vedder River or for that matter any river system, a bit disappointing to many of us to see recreational angling go in this direction.

[hue-nut]

This has been said time after time but when you are fishing with a float your leader should be around 12 to 18 inches and your float should be sitting straight up at all times and not laying on its side or you will just be doing a form of flossing. Of course you adjust the depth you are fishing by adjusting the float to the depth of the run you are fishing. At all times let the line run free off your center pin, level wind or spinning reel and donot hold back. The exception would be if you are fishing a blade as you have to hold back some to make the blade work well.

With all the pinks in the river even when short floating you will hook up the odd time by a non biting fish but not that many. You must be careful when winding in across the masses of pinks along the slower parts of the runs. However when you see people hauling them in backwards time after time you know the method they are using is not the best way to be fishing to take a biting fish. Some will disagree I know but the best offering to use to take coho and chinooks is good bait. In certain areas a spoon or blade works well too but with so many pinks foul hooking is a problem. I know there is exceptions as fish will take a good wool tie or fly but still bait is the best offering to use, just ask The Master, thats why he uses it most of the time at this time of year.

Unfortunately there is a very high percentage of snagging going on once again this year and I am sure all readers of this form have seen it first hand. As well no one race has a monoply over the snagging and flossing of fish as we all see it every day when on the Chillwack Vedder River or for that matter any river system, a bit disappointing to many of us to see recreational angling go in this direction.

well put Chris, "dead drifting" which is by far the most natural presentation, just free spooling with the current.

[gman]

Seems people are judged because they are Asian, Eastern European, too young, too old....  I think its good to ignore what people think, and even better to fish in the quiet spots wheres there's nobody around to comment on how you fish.  

[bbronswyk2000]

Why should the leader only be 12-18? In appropriate conditions I'll use a leader as long as 36" however I shorten my depth big time so I'm still well above the fish, it just gets my "candy" away from my lead and float.

Shorter leaders prevent flossing......

[gman]

That's why I am done with the Vedder until some heavy rain blows the river and cleans it of pinks.

Yeah if you want the fish to bite, and don't weant to fish the crowded spots the river can be a bit frustrating. Some people who fish a certain way, or fish the crowded meatholes will catch a lot more fish. Still you can enjoy the quiet spots on the river, and catch some biting fish and it can still be a very good experience....  

[itosh]

Hmmmmm.... must be an isolated incident cuz I'm as chinky eyed as they come (OK, maybe not as much as Rodney ) but I have never been confronted for snagging etc. even when I was just starting.... judging by your pics you seem to fish fairly popular areas on the lower river and this year the lower river is STACKED with pinks.... so the odd snagging will occur even if you are short floating.... fortunately pinks are small enough to bring in tail first, but if I was fishing a crowded area and accidently snagged a big spring/chum I would either try to break it off right away so as to not disrupt others or walk it down past everybody to break off or land (depending on how cheap I am feeling).... but I would definitely not come back up to my spot with a dead spring in my hand.... unfortunately crowded areas tend to have the most fish but maybe also the most opinionated.... I wonder how many actual coho take downs I missed thinking it might be the back of a pink....

Shane

[blaydRnr]

Shorter leaders prevent flossing......

especially in these low conditions...but i'm more concerned about the distance from float to weight...
i've seen fishers using high end tackle (i'll leave it at that) with 12 inch leaders, but have their floats set with bobber stoppers (bottom side 10 inches from the weight and the topside stopper set at 4 ft above)...who are they kidding?
i'm talking about runs no deeper than 2 to 4 ft.

i judge people strictly by the manner in which they fish.

[Steel_Mo_Head]

Why?  Because you are ASSUMING they are snagging?  The road goes both ways, S_M_H. 

And no because at the end of their drift all they are doing is REEFING the float as hard as they can to hook something. "every cast" there is a difference when it is incidental and intentional.  Im sure everyone here can tell the two apart. 

[Rodney]

That said, I'm as white as they come and have been told I'm snagging fish when I'm quite obviously short-floating bait well off the bottom.

What?? You're white? I've always assumed that you're not...

Stereotyping happens in all cultures, best to not worry about what others think about you (but be receptive to suggestions at the same time) and focus on what you can learn and improve on.

Today someone from the other side of the river told Chris and I that coho are passing through the ankle deep water that we were standing in and that we should get out of the water for him (especially since he arrived 4 hours after us).

http://www.fishingwithrod.com/blog/?p=147