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[Electroman]

Hey all just looking for some thoughts. Not new to fishing but about three years into still water fly fishing. I was away fishing last week and while fishing chironomids I was using a store bought tapered leader (12') then tied on a small swivel, about 3' of tippet, then my fly. Time after time I would hook a fish, play it for 30 secs, then it would break off on the rod end of the swivel. I was not playing the fish hard by any means. I connected the tippet and tapered leader to the swivel via improved cinch knots. Is it possible I just had a crummy tapered leader? Have you ever bought a bad leader? Or do you just figure it was nicked up and I must have missed the line damage?

[SteelheadAdict]

In my opinion tappers leaders are use less actept for dry fly fishing they are great don waste your time go get some maxima or segura florocarbon leader in 6,5,4 and then use to of each so for example 7 feet of 6 pound and 6 feet of 5 or vise versu whatever the fish can't see

[Electroman]

How does the florocarbon line layout when casting a sink tip line and a non dry fly?

[SteelheadAdict]

It lays out pretty goo just use a heavy line for your first bit of floro like a 6

[Electroman]

Thanks I appreciate the help. No I won't have and excuse when I loose one.

[Sandman]

I would get rid of the swivel.  Unless you are tossing big poppers for bass (or maybe big streamers) which may spin while casting, there really is no need for a swivel. Tying the tippet to leader with a blood knot or double surgeon's knot is much stronger than a clinch knot, improved or not.

[SteelheadAdict]

Thanks electro man I was just actually going to say the same thing u just said lol

[Electroman]

Thanks Sandman. I was trying to use the swivel to help get the fly down quicker. First real attempt at fishing chironomids and plan on scraping the swivel next time out and using some more patience.

[zabber]

What lb/x tapered leader were you using and how big were the fish? If it was too light that might have been the problem.

Try adding a small split shot bb or two if you scrap the swivel but still want to get the fly down faster.

[iCemAn]

Keep the swivel, you are using too much tippet. My wet fly setups with floating line are generally a 9' tapered leader, mono to extend as required, a swivel, and finally 18" of fluoro. This is how I fish everything wet, including chironomids up to 25' without a problem. Keep the fluoro minimal as it is cheaper and if you are fishing indicator it will slide right down to the swivel for easy landing.

If you eliminate the swivel with mono to fluoro, I would be careful with your knots cause you will probably burn the line and break off more frequently.

This is the setup I picked up from one of the best over the past few years and my catch ratio has increased significantly.

[Electroman]

iCemAn what type of knot do you use to attach your swivel? Guessing your line was >4lb?
The tapered leader I was using was 3.7 lb(don't remember what X it is) and I was adding 4lb mono to the swivel. The fish where maybe 3-4lbs but I was not playing the fish hard by any means.

[iCemAn]

I use double surgeons knot for tying my leader together. It's quick and fairly strong, as long as you wet the line before tightening.

That sounds like you were using a 6x tapered leader. Sound quite light and if you were breaking of above the swivel, I think you need to go to a stronger tapered leader to the swivel, and go less below. I generally use 3-4x depending on the lake I am fishing. Build the last of my taper as required and use anywhere from 3-5x fluoro for tippet (5-8lbs). Small fish or if I'm not getting any hits I will go smaller to a 6x, but rarely.

I landed a 6.5lbs rainbow last fall on 4x tapered leader with 5x tippet without a problem using the swivel under an indicator.

[Sandman]

Seems like Iceman has experience with swivels, and has sound advice.  As for the knot, I am not sure how you would use the surgeons knot to attach the swivel, but if there is a way it would be good, maybe a surgeon's loop?  In the mean time I would suggest a Trilene knot over the clinch, it is just as easy to tie but much stronger.  Make two passes through the swivel eye to create a loop and then tie off like the clinch, with the tag end passing through the double loop.  Remember to wet the line before tightening

[iCemAn]

Sorry for the confusion. The double surgeons knot is what I use for extending my leader, tying line to line. Blood knots work as well but not as quick, and suck if you are tying mono to fluoro.

As for tying to the swivel, I just use an improved clinch knot but I would also use the trilene knot as well. And always wet your line before tightening!

Here is a cool site to help you with your knots if you are getting stuck.

http://www.animatedknots.com/indexfishing.php

Good luck and let me know if you have any more questions.
Richard

[Electroman]

Thanks a lot fellas. Apreciate the help and look forward to getting out on the lake to try it all out.