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[AnnieP]

  Are you aware that fish health records are available online ? I know most anti farm supporters choose not to believe them but doesn't alter the fact they are online available to the public. Mainstream reported the IHN outbreak immediately it became suspect and made every effort to comply with CFIA. They reported the outbreak publicly and made no effort to hide it. Morton has made countless claims of disease in several species of salmon and trout yet there is no confirmation of that through the OIE website nor did CFIA or the DFO find ISA or one or two of the others she claims to have confirmed yet the anti crowd will believe anything and everything she says. I find that strange. She insinuates that naturally occuring diseases in wild salmon are in fact the fault of farmed salmon when it has been reported they originated with wild. Farms have to be diligent .

[aquapaloosa]

The answer to the first question is above, as for the second question (about the above quoted statement which is also elaborated upon above), I believe this has been answered already in my many comments on many threads on this topic.  However, in case it is not yet clear, no, my objection to farming Atlantic Salmon in open net pens in BC is not based on my claim that farms negate the natural order of things, although I am not sure how you could have thought that it was.  Selective memory loss?  Or just stirring the pot?  I will say, however, that many of my objections do stem from the fact that the industry has to deal with this fact within an environmentally sensitive area.  Remember the days when farmers could plow (and apply fertilizers and pesticides) right up to the stream bank?  Could you imagine a pig farmer today dumping manure into the river?  I know, an unfair comparison, but you get the idea.  My position on salmon farming stems from the reality that the  documented impacts of salmon farming and the remaining uncertainties surrounding its ecological risk means that decisions are being
based on uncertain or inadequate information.  All I keep hearing from farm supporters is: "That was true before, back when we didn't know better, but now we know better and are doing it right."  Well, what is the next learning curve going to bring?  The risks are too great.

Thanks for your reply SM. In your post you say "salmon farm densities negates the natural order".  I am just trying to narrow down your position on the issue.  No I am not dumb(selective memory loss), neither am I an idiot(stirring the pot).  Thanks for all the questions.  I guess I am a special case and for a fellow who follows this thread continuously, you will know that there is some repeating and its difficult to avoid. Look How many time has AF brought up PCPs over the years. (IT's just about due again, af.) He is the repeater here while most of us want to move on and get with the current so to speak.  YOur post suggest you have concern about the bottom.





http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZdxcgL8Kz4

[troutbreath]

Well it's nice to know that your not biased because your husband makes a living off the dirty fish. But I for one am a little sceptical about that claim. Also this "anti farmer" thing is so way out there. Us and them in battle over our right to raise salmon as cheaply and with potentially serious consequences to other marine life.

Nothing wrong with farming salmon. But you seem to take offence to the Coho that were raised in a differant manner than the unsafe way that your bread and butter is coming from. Really who are you trying to kid.

[AnnieP]

It was thanks to Alexandra Morton's court case that the management of aquaculture was taken away from the provincial governments and handed to the DFO. If you have issues with that perhaps you could direct your comments to her and ask her why she thought the feds could do a better job than the provincial regulators ?  Ms Morton has even suggested on her supporters web site she should run the DFO. That's a scary thought.

[alwaysfishn]

No she wasn't charged ........

I appreciate when we can get to the truth.

As far as enforcing the "quarantine"....  what do the feedlots do to ensure that none of the diseases and viruses they are propagating get outside of the "quarantine zone"? It seems pointless to put a "quarantine zone" in place and then allow all the diseases and viruses easy access to escape into the surrounding ocean.

Based on their inability to contain these diseases and viruses, what is the "quarantine" actually accomplishing? Perhaps that's why Morton was never arrested , because they would have had to arrest everyone else within miles of the farm. 

[aquapaloosa]

The quarantine does seem odd but when people are willing to infect farms on purpose I feel that the best thing to do is just keep everybody away. 

[AnnieP]

Well it's nice to know that your not biased because your husband makes a living off the dirty fish. But I for one am a little sceptical about that claim. Also this "anti farmer" thing is so way out there. Us and them in battle over our right to raise salmon as cheaply and with potentially serious consequences to other marine life.

Nothing wrong with farming salmon. But you seem to take offence to the Coho that were raised in a differant manner than the unsafe way that your bread and butter is coming from. Really who are you trying to kid.

I merely stated something to the effect that the closed containment coho I saw in Saveon last week wasn't too attractive. I regret not taking a photo with my camera phone as they were not too healthy looking. The small ones would have weighed less than two pounds before being harvested. And extremely freezer burnt. Some of the problem lies within the management of stores still trying to flog a product long after it has visibly lost it's appeal and that goes for wild or farmed. As for dirty fish that is taking your bias a little too far. What never seems to occur to people opposed to salmon farming  is that when someone like myself speaks it is perhaps with more knowledge about the industry than those opposed to it have. From experience if you get my meaning because my husband is employed in the industry. There is a lot of misconception and misinformation about how farmed salmon is raised.  I personally have no problem if an individual simply doesn't like the idea of farming fish . I don't often eat eggs myself. Just a personal dislike from childhood growing up on a farm with a rooster ands seeing blood in the eggs because they were fertile. But that doesn't mean I think no one else should eat them either or that they are bad for you or shouldn't have farmers growing chickens or producing eggs. Nor because of Avian flu outbreaks do I believe chicken farming should be banned and all chicken farms removed immediately. When those pro farm speak they speak with personal knowledge of the industry in most cases unlike the anti crowd who merely believe and repeat everything they hear.

[AnnieP]

I appreciate when we can get to the truth.

As far as enforcing the "quarantine"....  what do the feedlots do to ensure that none of the diseases and viruses they are propagating get outside of the "quarantine zone"? It seems pointless to put a "quarantine zone" in place and then allow all the diseases and viruses easy access to escape into the surrounding ocean.

Based on their inability to contain these diseases and viruses, what is the "quarantine" actually accomplishing? Perhaps that's why Morton was never arrested , because they would have had to arrest everyone else within miles of the farm. 

You seem to have lost sight of the fact IHN occurs naturally in wild Pacific sockeye  For instance-http://redoubtreporter.wordpress.com/2010/09/29/virus-strikes-salmon-fry-%e2%80%94-hatchery-loses-sockeye-stock-to-ihn/

[AnnieP]

I appreciate when we can get to the truth.

As far as enforcing the "quarantine"....  what do the feedlots do to ensure that none of the diseases and viruses they are propagating get outside of the "quarantine zone"? It seems pointless to put a "quarantine zone" in place and then allow all the diseases and viruses easy access to escape into the surrounding ocean.

Based on their inability to contain these diseases and viruses, what is the "quarantine" actually accomplishing? Perhaps that's why Morton was never arrested , because they would have had to arrest everyone else within miles of the farm.  

As someone who has asked me for proof of my claims perhaps you can provide us with the proof farms were/are propagating diseases outside what was a quarantine zone ? Since the disease was contained and the diseased fish including many healthy ones were in fact destroyed and the  farm fallowed and all equipment disinfected etc there has been no further spread of disease. I might add since the disease also appeared south of the border around the same time it is not unlikely the IHN originated in wild salmon returning to Washington state. There isn't much salmon farmers can do to quarantine wild salmon carrying IHN is there ? As for what do farms do to try and insure disease doesn't get outside the quarantine zone. Answer was obvious I thought. They try to prevent activists like Morton from violating the quarantine zone and perhaps deliberatly spreading the disease.

[alwaysfishn]

As someone who has asked me for proof of my claims perhaps you can provide us with the proof farms were/are propagating diseases outside what was a quarantine zone ? Since the disease was contained and the diseased fish including many healthy ones were in fact destroyed and the  farm fallowed and all equipment disinfected etc there has been no further spread of disease. I might add since the disease also appeared south of the border around the same time it is not unlikely the IHN originated in wild salmon returning to Washington state. There isn't much salmon farmers can do to quarantine wild salmon carrying IHN is there ? As for what do farms do to try and insure disease doesn't get outside the quarantine zone. Answer was obvious I thought. They try to prevent activists like Morton from violating the quarantine zone and perhaps deliberatly spreading the disease.

Let's agree on one thing, that the wild fish were in the ocean first. I get tired of hearing that the wild salmon are responsible for the diseases in the feedlots. I don't hear land based farmers complaining about how naturally occurring wild life is making their farm animals sick.

If the feedlots are convinced that wild salmon are making their feedlots sick, get the pens out of the ocean and on dry land! If we are to believe the feedlots, the only solution they are offering to disease control in their pens is to get rid of the wild salmon.....

Doesn't it seem rather hypocritical of the feedlots to complain when they feel a "quarantine zone" is breached, yet they offer no assurance that their diseases are being quarantined?    

[aquapaloosa]

Salmon farmers are not complaining about the origin of disease.  They realize it is the way it is as it is in most forms of husbandry.  Even if there were no wild salmon the farmers would still be subject to a equal variety of pathogens.  No salmon farming company or organization ever stated that the best way to prevent disease would be to get rid of wild salmon.  That is just ridiculous.  If I am wrong then please post the source of your comment.  If you do not post a source of that comment then admit you just made it up.

[AnnieP]

Let's agree on one thing, that the wild fish were in the ocean first. I get tired of hearing that the wild salmon are responsible for the diseases in the feedlots. I don't hear land based farmers complaining about how naturally occurring wild life is making their farm animals sick.

If the feedlots are convinced that wild salmon are making their feedlots sick, get the pens out of the ocean and on dry land! If we are to believe the feedlots, the only solution they are offering to disease control in their pens is to get rid of the wild salmon.....

Doesn't it seem rather hypocritical of the feedlots to complain when they feel a "quarantine zone" is breached, yet they offer no assurance that their diseases are being quarantined?    

Apparently you aren't aware of how much Marine Harvest Canada actually does to contribute to enhancement of wild salmon and provide assistance to local hatcheries . MHI regularly donates used hatchery equipment to local small hatcheries, they donated a dock for Roberts Lake and have beach clean up I believe twice a year. To claim they want wild salmon out of the ocean is just plain wrong. They also regularly have BBQ's with the funds raised going to local causes and salmon enhancement groups.



http://www.marineharvestcanada.com/people_donations.php


Supporting community organizations is something that Marine Harvest Canada takes pride in. Marine Harvest Canada believes in helping build strong communities. We support many community organizations including service groups, sports teams, social programs and salmon enhancement programs.

Watch for Marine Harvest Canada supporting community organizations in 2012.
[download document]

 
1st Willow Point Scouts
 2011 Applied Biology Conference
 2011 Sponsorship and Donations Summary
 2011 World Senior Badminton Tournament
 21st Century Communication Leadership
 BC Cancer Foundation
 BC Coalition of Motorcyclists
 BC Firefighters Burn Fund
 Beaver Harbour Community Fireworks
 Bike to Work Week
 Cameron's Cause for Kids Society
 Campbell River Adult Care Society
 Campbell River Beacon Club
 Campbell River Christian School
 Campbell River Community Foundation
 Campbell River Curling Club
 Campbell River Daybreak Rotary
 Campbell River Dragon Boat Society
 Campbell River Family Services Society
 Campbell River Fish and Wildlife Association
 Campbell River Food Bank
 Campbell River Garden Club
 Campbell River Golden Wings Soccer
 Campbell River Head Injury Support Society
 Campbell River Hospice Society
 Campbell River Hospital Foundation
 Campbell River Judo Club
 Campbell River Kings Show & Shine
 Campbell River Kinsmen Club
 Campbell River Minor Baseball
 Campbell River Minor Hockey Association
 Campbell River Noon Rotary
 Campbell River Perinatal Society
 Campbell River Pioneer Hockey League
 Campbell River Relay for Life
 Campbell River Rotary Club
 Campbell River Salmon Foundation
 Campbell River Scouts
 Campbell River Search and Rescue
 Campbell River Slow Pitch
 Campbell River SPCA
 Campbell River Storm Hockey Club
 Campbell River Swim Club
 Campbell River Tyee Club
 Campbell River Warriors Ball Hockey
 Campfire Ministries
 Canadian Cancer Society
 Canadian Waterman Festival
 Chimo Gymnastics Club
 Communities in Bloom
 Compass Adventure Sailing
 Cops for Cancer, Tour de Rock
 Courtenay Atom Blizzards
 Courtenay Rotary Auction
 Cowichan Valley Bulldogs Football
 CR50K Trail Challenge
 Crimson Coast Dance Society
 Cystic Fibrosis Canada
 Discovery Passage Boat Rodeo
 Discovery Toastmasters
 Ducks Unlimited Canada
 Ducks Unlimited Canada - Comox Valley Chapter
 Duncan Volunteer Fire Fighters
 Eagle View Elementary School Spring Fun Fair
 Ecole Willow Point
 Elks of Canada
 Fraternal Order of Eagles Pacific Curling Bonspiel
 Friends of the Kelsey Centre Society
 Goldstream Volunteer Salmonid Enhancement Society
 Habitat for Humanity
 Heart and Stroke Foundation
 Howie Meeker Charity Golf Classic
 Kingcome Inlet Christmas
 Kingcome Wellness Conference
 Kitasoo Community School
 

Kitasoo/Xai/xais Prince Rupert All Native Basketball Tournament
 Kitasoo/Xai'xais Kitamaat Reclamation Celebration
 Kiwanis Sunrise
 Klemtu Stewart Wallis Memorial Basketball Tournament
 Knights of Columbus
 Knights of Columbus
 Kwakiutl Fisheries Fry Release
 Kwalikum Secondary School
 Lyndon's Legacy Mixed Slo-Pitch Tournament
 Marine Harvest Bandits Ladies Soccer
Marine Harvest Ladies Curling Open
 Nanaimo Folk Festival
 North Island College
 North Island Dragon Boat Society
 North Island Eagles Bantam Rep Hockey
 North Island Early Child Development Society
 North Island Hamper Fund
 North Island Lanes
 North Island Secondary School
 North Island Silvertips
 North Island Silvertips Hockey
 North Island Youth Wellness Conference
 Nuyumbalees Cultural Centre
 Oceans Day
 Oyster River Enhancement Society
 Pacific Salmon Foundation
 Peir Street Farmers Market and Arts Fair
 Porsche Club of America
 Port Alice Rumblefest
 Port Hardy Chamber Awards
 Port Hardy Filomi Days
 Port Hardy Relay for Life
 Port Hardy Rotary Club
 Port Hardy Secondary School
 Port Hardy Slo Pitch
 Port McNeill Chinook Club
 Port McNeill Orca Fest
 Port McNeill Rotary Club
 Positive Aquaculture Awareness Slo-Pitch
 Quatsino Sound Fishing Derby
 Ralph Boyd Men's Curling Bonspiel
 Rotary Dancing and Tapas
 Salt Spring Island Fire Rescue
 Salvation Army
 Saratoga Speedway
 Sarita River Chinook Enhancement
 Sayward Kusam Klimb
 Sayward Parent Advisory Committee (PAC)
 Sayward RCMP Bike Rodeo
 Sayward School PAC
 Sayward Senior Christmas Dinner
 Sayward Tour De Rock
 Shinto-Ryu Karate Club
 Shito-Ryu Karate Club
 Special Olympics BC
 Storey Creek Men's Golf Tournament
 Storey Creek Mixed Golf Tournament
 Strathcona Triathlon Club
 Success by 6
 Telus Van Isle 360 Yacht Race
 The Canadian MPS Society
 The Canadian Society for Mucopolysaccharide
 The Nature Trust of BC
 Tsolum River Restoration Society
 United Mennonite Church Africa Famine Relief
 United Way
 Vancouve Island University
 Vancouver Island Escape RV Club
 Vanier Secondary School
 VGH & UBC Hospital Foundation
 Victoria Fish and Game Protective Association
 Y.A.N.A.
 Young Life Nanaimo

 


Marine Harvest Canada Supporting Community Organizations in 2010.
[download document]
Now tell me salmon aquaculture contributes nothing to the community. Let's see your list 

[alwaysfishn]

Salmon farmers are not complaining about the origin of disease.  They realize it is the way it is as it is in most forms of husbandry.  Even if there were no wild salmon the farmers would still be subject to a equal variety of pathogens.  No salmon farming company or organization ever stated that the best way to prevent disease would be to get rid of wild salmon.  That is just ridiculous.  If I am wrong then please post the source of your comment.  If you do not post a source of that comment then admit you just made it up.

Sorry to see you misunderstood my comments.....

I'll try to rephrase: Since the feedlots point their fingers at the wild salmon being the cause of their diseases, and the feedlots refuse to move on dry land, away from the wild salmon, it seems natural to assume that the only solution to their diseases is to get rid of the wild salmon.....

However I agree with you that's it's ridiculous to entertain the idea of getting rid of the wild salmon. You then need to agree with me that the only plausible solution is to get rid of the feedlots.

[aquapaloosa]

Sorry to see you misunderstood my comments.....

I'm not a mind reader.  It read that way pretty clearly. 

Let's agree on one thing, that the wild fish were in the ocean first. I get tired of hearing that the wild salmon are responsible for the diseases in the feedlots. I don't hear land based farmers complaining about how naturally occurring wild life is making their farm animals sick.

If the feedlots are convinced that wild salmon are making their feedlots sick, get the pens out of the ocean and on dry land! If we are to believe the feedlots, the only solution they are offering to disease control in their pens is to get rid of the wild salmon.....

Doesn't it seem rather hypocritical of the feedlots to complain when they feel a "quarantine zone" is breached, yet they offer no assurance that their diseases are being quarantined?  Roll Eyes  Roll Eyes

[aquapaloosa]

You then need to agree with me that the only plausible solution is to get rid of the feedlots.

There isn't a pressing consistent disease issue overall so the need to get rid of them is not there.

Have you been hearing news about a virus in Cultus Lake wild salmon?.. A fact sheet has been posted on the BCSFA Hot Topics page for everyone’s reference.
PISCINE REovaRus (PRV) AND HSMI
Key Points:
·         Fish on BC’s salmon farms are healthy and there are no unexplained or unusual mortalities occurring on our sites.
·         While viruses are extremely common in the marine environment, the vast majority of them does not cause any disease or harm to fish. PRV has been detected in healthy fish in healthy populations: showing that its presence does not mean disease occurs.
PAA Note: read more key points at link below.
…Statements made connecting PRV in Cultus Lake trout with our salmon farms, or suggesting a level of effect of PRV in these populations far overreach current knowledge and are making assumptions and drawing unsupported conclusions — as did claims in April this year by anti-salmon farm activist Alexandra Morton.

http://www.salmonfarmers.org./sites/default/files/hot-topics/prv_hsmi_2_1.pdf

http://www.salmonfarmers.org./hot-topics