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[Kjle]

Hey everyone, this is my first post here, though I've been observing for a while. That being said, I thought I'd introduce myself. I'm Kyle, I've been fishing for a few years but only started doing it seriously in the last two. So, I'm trying to take every opportunity to learn how to fish, while being respectful to the river and the people who fish it.

So I have a question, and I'd like to get the professional opinion of some of you who have a lot more experience.

Today I went to fish the Stave in hopes of scoring some clean female chums and some nice roe. I started off just fishing wool and was fishing a 6 ft deep slow-moving section. I had about 2 ft from my float to my weight, and about 1 foot from my weight to my hook with wool on. I hooked into about 15-20 in 3 hours and brought about 10 in. 1 was snagged in the back, another was in the side of the head. Both of which I carefully and promptly released. Every other fish was clearly a bite in the back of the throat or the tongue or tip of the jaw.

A certain individual began to rudely give me heck about snagging all these fish. I could not understand his logic. He argued my float to weight distance was too long and that's why I snagged fish. I had no intentions of doing so. If I really wanted to, I would throw a bouncing betty on and dredge the bottom like the crowds do.

Was this guy (read: know-it-all) correct? Was my setup rigged in such a way that would cause me to snag a lot of fish?

[CohoMan]

I think you have the right depth and right size leader.

The problem is that you are fishing in a section that is loaded with hundreds of chums. No matter if you are short floating or not, you will bound to snag a few.

If you were targeting chums for the roe, I would suggest you get your limit and go instead of having to deal with the "know it all" type.

[FlyFishin Magician]

Hey everyone, this is my first post here, though I've been observing for a while. That being said, I thought I'd introduce myself. I'm Kyle, I've been fishing for a few years but only started doing it seriously in the last two. So, I'm trying to take every opportunity to learn how to fish, while being respectful to the river and the people who fish it.

So I have a question, and I'd like to get the professional opinion of some of you who have a lot more experience.

Today I went to fish the Stave in hopes of scoring some clean female chums and some nice roe. I started off just fishing wool and was fishing a 6 ft deep slow-moving section. I had about 2 ft from my float to my weight, and about 1 foot from my weight to my hook with wool on. I hooked into about 15-20 in 3 hours and brought about 10 in. 1 was snagged in the back, another was in the side of the head. Both of which I carefully and promptly released. Every other fish was clearly a bite in the back of the throat or the tongue or tip of the jaw.

A certain individual began to rudely give me heck about snagging all these fish. I could not understand his logic. He argued my float to weight distance was too long and that's why I snagged fish. I had no intentions of doing so. If I really wanted to, I would throw a bouncing betty on and dredge the bottom like the crowds do.

Was this guy (read: know-it-all) correct? Was my setup rigged in such a way that would cause me to snag a lot of fish?

I fail to understand the logic in assuming you were snagging fish when 2 out of 10 landed were foul hooked.  Your set-up sounds like a "short float" method to me.  What size of hook were you using, and what pound leader?  What size piece of wool?  How were you setting the hook?  Sometimes I see guys lifting the rod tip and "jerking" at the end of every cast.  There's no doubt what they're doing then!  When the run is thick full of fish, it's hard not to foul hook some.

When you landed your fish, did you beach any?  Or did you get right into the water with the fish to release them?

So - you were fishing a 6 foot section, with 2 feet between your float and weight, and 1 foot leader.  Definitely not too long IMHO.  Either you ran into an jerk, or I'm missing something here...

[typhoon]

Was your drift drag free or were you holding back?
Even with the proper setup you can floss fish by swinging through a herd of chum.
I like to short float quite high when the chum are thick. If your weight wasn't hitting bottom then you're probably okay.

[Fish Assassin]

Sounds like short floating to me. There will always be those people who bitch about this or that.

[milo]

Without having been there, it is hard to make an accurate judgment.
You failed to tell us how long your leader was (from swivel to hook) as its length has significant bearing on how many fish you may or may not have flossed.
Anything over 24", and you are certain to floss a few fish when they travel thick. Heck, you can floss a fish with a 12 inch leader! It all depends how many fish are in the system at the time and what your intention is. Chum love to surface - they love porpoising, so it is not unusual to accidentally floss them or snag them even when you are short floating.

The only way to avoid flossing or lining fish is by using circle hooks. Otherwise, a flossed or snagged fish from time to time is the price you pay for the fun.
Even the most proficient short-floaters and blade users occasionally floss fish - especially in very murky conditions like yesterday. Even fly fishers floss fish when the fish travel thick.  Don't believe anyone who tells you they never get to floss or snag salmon - they are either lying or living in denial.

As for your experience yesterday with the know-it-all, don't sweat it. From the sounds of it and assuming your leader wasn't too long, the guy was simply jealous that things were working so great for you. I've had a similar thing happen to me last year on a slough I was fishing. I was into my 6th or 7th coho and a guy had the gall to tell me I was lining the coho with my fly line. Thing is, it was slough water, without movement, and I was catching them on the retrieve - in the mouth every time. They were just hot for my fly and not for his roe.
Sounds to me something similar happened yesterday - the fish were there, you got everything right, so someone just got a tad jealous.

Keep up the good job and thanks for bringing your doubts up on the forum.

[leapin' tyee]

Your set up was right..You will always run into Mr. Know It All at the river. If you are not intentionally snagging fish. Who care what they say, They just want to ruin your day. I will tell them to take a hike.

[Fillibert]

Since when do flossers release fish. That about settles it

[leaping steely]

Your set up was right..You will always run into Mr. Know It All at the river. If you are not intentionally snagging fish. Who care what they say, They just want to ruin your day. I will tell them to take a hike.

^This. There are a lot of condescending know-it-alls on the river these days. Even with a proper short-floating setup, you are bound to foul hook/floss/whatever one or two when the fish are in thick. Your setup sounds fine; the vast majority of your fish were hooked legitimately by the sounds of it. If you want to try to minimize snagging/flosssing even further, you could try spots that aren't as thick with Chum.  Who knows, you might get a shot at a Coho.  

[leapin' tyee]

Even the most proficient short-floaters and blade users occasionally floss fish - especially in very murky conditions like yesterday. Even fly fishers floss fish when the fish travel thick.  Don't believe anyone who tells you they never get to floss or snag salmon - they are either lying or living in denial.

Hey Milo, you are so right.

[dcajaxs]

I had a mr know it all a couple weeks back yell at an angler beside me.  Was making all a fuss and didnt' even bother to ask us who were fishing beside him if the accusations were true.  sounds like you were short floating though I would try a little bit of a smaller leader as it may reduce your the snag ratio

[BigFisher]

I had a mr know it all a couple weeks back yell at an angler beside me.  Was making all a fuss and didnt' even bother to ask us who were fishing beside him if the accusations were true.  sounds like you were short floating though I would try a little bit of a smaller leader as it may reduce your the snag ratio

Was the guy yelling across the river?

[NiceFish]

At the stave i fish usually the top 2 feet of water, with 18" leader or less.  To avoid snagging fish as they do stack up in large numbers and also to target only the fresh more aggressive fish. Seems to work well. I haven't pulled in very many moldy ones this year.

[Kjle]

Thanks for the affirmation, everyone. I'm happy to hear I was not in the wrong.

Without having been there, it is hard to make an accurate judgment.
You failed to tell us how long your leader was (from swivel to hook) as its length has significant bearing on how many fish you may or may not have flossed.
Anything over 24", and you are certain to floss a few fish when they travel thick. Heck, you can floss a fish with a 12 inch leader! It all depends how many fish are in the system at the time and what your intention is. Chum love to surface - they love porpoising, so it is not unusual to accidentally floss them or snag them even when you are short floating.

I mentioned that my leader was only about a foot long. And all the fish I pulled up were quite clean and gave a good fight, whereas the flossers were pulling in old boots.

[Kjle]

I fail to understand the logic in assuming you were snagging fish when 2 out of 10 landed were foul hooked.  Your set-up sounds like a "short float" method to me.  What size of hook were you using, and what pound leader?  What size piece of wool?  How were you setting the hook?  Sometimes I see guys lifting the rod tip and "jerking" at the end of every cast.  There's no doubt what they're doing then!  When the run is thick full of fish, it's hard not to foul hook some.

When you landed your fish, did you beach any?  Or did you get right into the water with the fish to release them?

So - you were fishing a 6 foot section, with 2 feet between your float and weight, and 1 foot leader.  Definitely not too long IMHO.  Either you ran into an jerk, or I'm missing something here...

I had a piece of wool the size of a single egg on a #2 hook with 10 lb leader. I waited for fish to strike and I jerked and set the hook. I don't know how I could've done things "any more legal."