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[Dave]

Did you miss the part about warming water?  Did you read Bob's post about toxic algae and how it affects salmon rearing in the ocean?

[shuswapsteve]

Good to see them putting some funds and work into this and a good P/R move too. I see they are blaming logging and habitat loss for the loss of wild salmon stocks to many rivers, no mention of other causes.

I guess if they didn't donate anything then it would be seen as a poor P/R move and there would inevitably be those that would critical of that, so it's a case of damned if you do and damned if you don't. I wonder how much money, equipment and expertise Raincoast Conservation Foundation, Watershed Watch Salmon Society, David Suzuki Foundation and the Coastal Alliance for Aquaculture Reform and Living Oceans Society have donated lately to these local salmon enhancement facilities?  I mean you have all these groups that claim to love wild salmon, but I wonder how many of them are putting money into these grassroot projects.  Are other stakeholders (like commercial fisheries) and other industries stepping up to help these local salmon enhancement facilities? Some of that equipment if purchased new would be a huge expense for those with shoestring budgets. Even if technology changes, that equipment that is donated is still very usable and valuable to those local groups. If they can make use of it that is a plus.  Saves these groups some money and it's doesn't end up in a landfill.

[chris gadsden]

From the Carvan From Wild Salmon to get your day off to a good start.    https://youtu.be/F2-sT2CUd84

[chris gadsden]

And for Dave. https://youtu.be/8KmHFZ_hzQ8

[ClayoquotKid]

Good to see them putting some funds and work into this and a good P/R move too. I see they are blaming logging and habitat loss for the loss of wild salmon stocks to many rivers, no mention of other causes.

Given the nature of the job - working on the water, running boats, watching salmon eat - it's pretty fair to say that a high % of aquaculture workers are avid fishers.

Maybe they volunteer, donate, and support enhancement and habitat causes because they actually care?

You may need to create the distinction to rationalize your position, but your "side" doesn't have a monopoly on caring about wild salmon.

[chris gadsden]

Given the nature of the job - working on the water, running boats, watching salmon eat - it's pretty fair to say that a high % of aquaculture workers are avid fishers.

Maybe they volunteer, donate, and support enhancement and habitat causes because they actually care?

You may need to create the distinction to rationalize your position, but your "side" doesn't have a monopoly on caring about wild salmon.

As I believe you work for the FF industry do you see any negatives or is everything fine from your standpoint?

[ClayoquotKid]

As I believe you work for the FF industry do you see any negatives or is everything fine from your standpoint?

I do work in the salmon aquaculture industry, and have for more than a decade.

During that time I have never seen an example of where salmon aquaculture in BC has been shown to cause a decline in wild salmon populations anywhere farms exist.

What I have seen - from a boat, from a kayak, from the beach, from the riverbank, from anywhere I have actively and passionately fished for any number of species over the years - is many, many, observable one-time and annually repeating impacts on fish populations that have absolutely nothing to do with the culturing of salmon in pens on the Coast.

The criticisms of salmon aquaculture start at an assumption of harm lacking evidence, and then work backwards to fill in areas where limited and incomplete data serves to support the "Precautionary Principle" in the construct of peer-reviewed risk analyses utilising "may" and "could" to give the appearance of a statistical reality.

What has been, and continues to be lacking, is a testable and repeatable hypothesis which identifies a signal from aquaculture within the wide range of factors known to influence wild salmon populations.

I've spent almost half my time in the industry working directly with enhancement groups trying to boost salmon populations in the areas we operate, and have also led wild salmonid sea lice data collection projects mirroring Morton's work in the Broughton, as well as being Co-Chair of the Clayoquot Salmon Roundtable group for the last few years - so I am quite familiar with what we know and don't know about the success of many different runs on the coast.

I am thankful that there are many groups and individuals out there who are asking all the questions regarding salmon survival, and not simply beating the dead horse of a "smoking gun" they seem to think aquaculture holds.

I don't mean to rag on you personally Chris, but I have to say you are part of a group which is so startlingly myopic in your campaign against farmed salmon, I truly feel you miss out on a great deal of opportunity to find common ground.

[chris gadsden]

I do work in the salmon aquaculture industry, and have for more than a decade.

During that time I have never seen an example of where salmon aquaculture in BC has been shown to cause a decline in wild salmon populations anywhere farms exist.

What I have seen - from a boat, from a kayak, from the beach, from the riverbank, from anywhere I have actively and passionately fished for any number of species over the years - is many, many, observable one-time and annually repeating impacts on fish populations that have absolutely nothing to do with the culturing of salmon in pens on the Coast.

The criticisms of salmon aquaculture start at an assumption of harm lacking evidence, and then work backwards to fill in areas where limited and incomplete data serves to support the "Precautionary Principle" in the construct of peer-reviewed risk analyses utilising "may" and "could" to give the appearance of a statistical reality.

What has been, and continues to be lacking, is a testable and repeatable hypothesis which identifies a signal from aquaculture within the wide range of factors known to influence wild salmon populations.

I've spent almost half my time in the industry working directly with enhancement groups trying to boost salmon populations in the areas we operate, and have also led wild salmonid sea lice data collection projects mirroring Morton's work in the Broughton, as well as being Co-Chair of the Clayoquot Salmon Roundtable group for the last few years - so I am quite familiar with what we know and don't know about the success of many different runs on the coast.

I am thankful that there are many groups and individuals out there who are asking all the questions regarding salmon survival, and not simply beating the dead horse of a "smoking gun" they seem to think aquaculture holds.

I don't mean to rag on you personally Chris, but I have to say you are part of a group which is so startlingly myopic in your campaign against farmed salmon, I truly feel you miss out on a great deal of opportunity to find common ground.

Thanks for this. Of course as I have said before I worry about what FF have done in other countries and it could happen here over time.

We have, as a human race has in the past and are still making many mistakes that are running our planet a bit at a time.

The good point from those opposed to FF it helps keep the industry on its toes. Its like in our democratic government system if there was no opposition to those in power they could do what they like although some try to do that, but as the last federal election showed, they were sent to the other side of the house.

 Thanks again for our post, Merry Christmas and Happy New Year and good sports fishing too.

[Dave]

A nicely worded and well measured response CK.  We FWR members are happy you're willing to share your hands on knowledge and expertise on this contentious issue.
As I have said many times before, fish farming as it is practiced on this coast is just a scapegoat for the real reasons wild salmon populations are dropping.

[troutbreath]

I know saying this is about as ineffective as SLICE is becoming on sealice, but saying people here are against salmon farming is not true. Just the way their farmed. But at least you guys have a few shoulders to cry on now. 

[santefe]

Quite some time ago, years in fact, I saw a video, I think it was entitled "Calling from the Coast"
Any way It was Ms. Morton netting juvenile salmon in the Discovery Passage area near some fish farms.
These little salmon were heavily infested with sea lice.  I know that sea lice are a natural occurring fact of life in the ocean.
But thousands of salmon in a pen on a salmon migration route is not natural.
It has made a believer in me that ocean net pen farmed salmon are a detriment to our wild salmon stocks.
And nothing will change my mind on this matter.  And eventually we are going to pay a heavy price because of farmed salmon in  the ocean.

[Fisherbob]

I know saying this is about as ineffective as SLICE is becoming on sealice, but saying people here are against salmon farming is not true. Just the way their farmed. But at least you guys have a few shoulders to cry on now. 

There they're their TB, no use crying over something that is not going away. Perhaps this may make you feel better.

http://www.education.com/worksheet/article/there-their-theyre-third/

http://youtu.be/0QsCrFANMzc

[Dave]

And nothing will change my mind on this matter.

Bingo, I think you nailed it. Do some research on Pink salmon population fluctuations in the Broughton area; go back before fish farms and compare the numbers to the last few cycles.  Google is your friend but if your mind is made up don’t waste your time; send money to Almo.

[Fisherbob]

http://salmonfarmscience.com/2013/04/18/landmark-collaborative-sea-lice-study-published/

[chris gadsden]

http://salmonfarmscience.com/2013/04/18/landmark-collaborative-sea-lice-study-published/

From your link. "About this blog"

"We are unashamedly pro-aquaculture."
And

mikearmstrong184
2013/04/19 at 11:17

You just pointed out with the formula the problem with this discussion. It your world it is all about what is in the pen! No one disputes that the sea lice come from the wild fish. Locking millions of Atlantics in an open net pen, providing hundreds of thousands of hosts for lice incubation, is the issue.

Show me the data that says if this formula & Slice applied at 3 lice/fish (6 x the Norwegian threshold of .5/fish), there is a corresponding drop in lice on the wild stock. If a Fraser wild salmon swims north and only picks up 1 louse per site as it passes, it will not survive. You have multiple farm operations leaching adult and larval sea lice, sited right on the migration route the wild stocks will follow.
Reply
mikearmstrong184
2013/04/18 at 12:16

Good paper on what happens inside the pen. Now where is the coloration between the reduced sea louse counts inside the pens, and the count on the wild fish passing by outside.
Where are the corresponding wild smolt lice infection numbers? Does a reduction of lice inside the pen result in an infection reduction on the wild salmon smolt outside?
Wild salmon don’t get inoculated against disease or treated with Slice. 3 gravid lice/fish on a site with 1,000,000 fish could produce 1,800,000.000 larva every 2 to 3 weeks.
Why is the acceptable threshold here of 3 so much higher than in Norway where a count of .5 females/fish triggering a treatment.
The Atlantic smolts attacked in Norway are 5 to6 inches in length and scales up when they pass the open net pens.