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[TNAngler]

Hey guys.  Long time listener, first time poster.

I am a member of the hated bottom bouncers, except I do it right.  I was up in the area for 10 days visiting family and went fishing 4 times.  During that time, my dad, my wife, and I caught about 50 sockeye (lost probably a quarter that many), 2 kings in the boat (not big, 10-15 pounds each) and 1 other that took us for a long run but wrapped me around a tree under the water (we were fishing a new area as our old hole is only 3 feet deep now.  I estimate it was over 30 pounds).  We launched at island 22.  We went the Monday, Wednesday, and Friday the first week it was open, then the next Monday (which was this week Monday).  This Monday was after the nets had been in the water all weekend and we only caught 3 sockeye that day and all the jumpers that had been around were gone. 

The most frustrating part of that day was that a FN member drifted a net right down in front of about 30 boats, only about 30 feet in front of us, well within our casting range.  Heck, it was within my wife's casting range and this was her first time casting and therefore was probably the shortest caster there.  There were many words spoken to him and I'm pretty sure someone went back to the launch to report him but he only made that one set and left.  I think if he had made another set he might have caught a weight to the back of the head on an "accidental cast".  He caught nothing on the set.  I didn't feel bad for him at all.

Sadly, most of the time we were the only ones catching fish.  Sure a couple other sockeye were caught or a couple went out with kings but for the other 5-10 boats around that we could see, combined they would catch one sockeye for ever 3-5 we caught.  Actually, that might be a little low.  The great thing about this year was that most of the sockeye we were catching were much larger than previous years.  It has been averaging about 5 pounds on the sockeye but this trip there were some that were 10 or so.  Big and bright and fiesty.

Of all the fish we caught, only one of them was flossed and even that one was hooked in the mouth.  Most were up through the nose, some were in the outside cheek.  I know the grippers and rippers that you are talking about and there are many up there and they disgust me as much if not more than most of you.  I also saw a number of them catch smaller fish that were kept.  I suppose they could have been very small kings but I doubt it and on Wednesday when we were checked by the DFO at the launch we let them know.  In my opinion, if you aren't going to get the fish to hit and catch it right, there is no sense even going.  Just stay home.

So, if you can time it right around the nets, there are definitely fish to be had if you do it right.

[trot]

All those sockeye are flossed....what kind of thought process do you have on what you are doing? I am quite confused, you think those sockeye bit? The reason I and others hate on flossing BITING fish(Chinook) is because sockeye are not open. Do you think when you snag all these sockeye that they all happily swim away? Bar fish or use other ethical ways to target Chinook-sockeye are closed so why do it?

By the way I am trying to stay civil and mean no offence in my post-I am just astounded that you think what you are doing is correct.

[TNAngler]

If you know what you are doing, sockeye will bite.  Heck, they almost tore the pole out of my hand a couple times.  We weren't trying to catch the sockeye, we were throwing out deeper where the kings were.  I would have been happy only catching kings.

If you can't tell based on how it feels and where it is hooked whether it is flossed or not, then yeah, you are probably flossing everything.  I've been fishing similar to this for 30 years.  I know when a fish hits and when it just gets a line in it's mouth.

Also, our setup is very specific.  If we change the color just slightly, we don't catch anything.  So if you think a change in the color will suddenly turn a flosser that outfishes everyone on the bar to a flosser that catches nothing....

[river walker]

If you know what you are doing, sockeye will bite.  Heck, they almost tore the pole out of my hand a couple times.  We weren't trying to catch the sockeye, we were throwing out deeper where the kings were.  I would have been happy only catching kings.

If you can't tell based on how it feels and where it is hooked whether it is flossed or not, then yeah, you are probably flossing everything.  I've been fishing similar to this for 30 years.  I know when a fish hits and when it just gets a line in it's mouth.

Also, our setup is very specific.  If we change the color just slightly, we don't catch anything.  So if you think a change in the color will suddenly turn a flosser that outfishes everyone on the bar to a flosser that catches nothing....

Regs say selective fishing methods only.....to target Chinook. You bar fish. If you are bouncing bottom you are snagging fish plain and simple.  Real sportsman don't snag fish....
there should be a course in order to get a fishing licence, same as hunting.
bottom bouncing springs is not selective.plain and simple.
6 times out bar fishing 4 springs caught for me. Hooked inside the mouth with bait and 00 spinnglo.
zero sockeye hooked. Imagine that

[banx]

Regs say selective fishing methods only.....to target Chinook. You bar fish. If you are bouncing bottom you are snagging fish plain and simple.  Real sportsman don't snag fish....
there should be a course in order to get a fishing licence, same as hunting.
bottom bouncing springs is not selective.plain and simple.
6 times out bar fishing 4 springs caught for me. Hooked inside the mouth with bait and 00 spinnglo.
zero sockeye hooked. Imagine that

I disagree with this statement completely.  I grew up 'bottom bouncing' pencil weights and slinky's.  I catch my fish in the mouth and they bite.  There is a HUGE difference when it bites compared to swimming across your line.  If you had a few seasons of actually trying it you would know for yourself.

I've fished the vedder and had people come down and accuse me of snagging till they see fish on the beach with a hook buried through it's beak.  then they ask to see my setups and how i'm fishing them.......  and like the previous poster said, you change colours or size and the bite is off.

i'm talking about a completely different technique than reel in and rip reel in and rip.

what i coonsider 'flossing'  is the complete BS i see around the tamihi rapids, where you throw your float in for 1.757 seconds and rip it.  that is disgusting.

[TNAngler]

Regs say selective fishing methods only.....to target Chinook. You bar fish. If you are bouncing bottom you are snagging fish plain and simple.  Real sportsman don't snag fish....
there should be a course in order to get a fishing licence, same as hunting.
bottom bouncing springs is not selective.plain and simple.
6 times out bar fishing 4 springs caught for me. Hooked inside the mouth with bait and 00 spinnglo.
zero sockeye hooked. Imagine that

You know what I find odd?  We were checked, one of the days we brought home a Chinook by DFO.  One of the things she checked was where the fish was hooked.  According to her definition, it was not snagged.  She spent a lot of time checking our gear and everything we were doing as there was nobody else coming in at the time.  She had no problem with anything we had done.  We have been checked and watched numerous times over the years.  There has never been an issue.  We don't set the hook until they hit.  Heck, if I feel it flossing them, I drop my rod because that isn't how I want to catch fish.

If I am bottom bouncing and thereby "snagging" fish as you claim, how do you explain changing color of yarn and leaving the rest of the setup exactly the same turning catching fish all the time to nothing?  And I'm not talking just this year.  Back in the 90s and 2000s when the runs were really good, we could catch a sockeye every other cast with our set up but if we changed color, nothing.  Heck, there were times when my arms hurt so bad from fighting fish that I would put on a different color just to take a break and experiment for other color combinations that might work in case ours stopped one day.  Just because you don't know how to get sockeye to hit doesn't mean it isn't possible.

And let's forget about Monday because if I had known the nets were in all weekend I wouldn't have gone.  So, I have 3 days fishing, 3 Chinook hooked, 2 caught and the one we lost was because it was a new area and didn't know not to let the fish go into a certain area and you can't afford that lack of knowledge with a huge Chinook.  Every sockeye and king I have caught were hooked inside the mouth.  About half are through the nose.  Imagine that.

[TNAngler]

I disagree with this statement completely.  I grew up 'bottom bouncing' pencil weights and slinky's.  I catch my fish in the mouth and they bite.  There is a HUGE difference when it bites compared to swimming across your line.  If you had a few seasons of actually trying it you would know for yourself.

I've fished the vedder and had people come down and accuse me of snagging till they see fish on the beach with a hook buried through it's beak.  then they ask to see my setups and how i'm fishing them.......  and like the previous poster said, you change colours or size and the bite is off.

i'm talking about a completely different technique than reel in and rip reel in and rip.

what i coonsider 'flossing'  is the complete BS i see around the tamihi rapids, where you throw your float in for 1.757 seconds and rip it.  that is disgusting.

People have accused us of snagging/flossing frequently too until they watch us and check stuff out.  Then when they realize that isn't what we are doing, then they want to know our secret.

Reep and reel fisherman are horrible.  Unless it's a run like 3 years ago (which I sadly missed) or pinks are swarming the river and you are getting bites three, four, five times on each drift, you shouldn't be setting the hook on every cast, let alone multiple times per cast.  You set the hook when the fish hits and that is it.  If you were to watch us, most of our drifts last week resulted in no hook sets.  We got hits and lost some fish but those were usually at the very bottom of our drift where the smaller sockeye are and since the angle is worse they don't get a good angle when hitting it.  I would say 75% of our hook sets resulted in a fish on for at least 10 seconds, with 50% resulting in fish to the boat.

[joshhowat]

People have accused us of snagging/flossing frequently too until they watch us and check stuff out.  Then when they realize that isn't what we are doing, then they want to know our secret.

Reep and reel fisherman are horrible.  Unless it's a run like 3 years ago (which I sadly missed) or pinks are swarming the river and you are getting bites three, four, five times on each drift, you shouldn't be setting the hook on every cast, let alone multiple times per cast.  You set the hook when the fish hits and that is it.  If you were to watch us, most of our drifts last week resulted in no hook sets.  We got hits and lost some fish but those were usually at the very bottom of our drift where the smaller sockeye are and since the angle is worse they don't get a good angle when hitting it.  I would say 75% of our hook sets resulted in a fish on for at least 10 seconds, with 50% resulting in fish to the boat.

A good flosser will only set the hook when they feel the line bump a fish. Since they almost always catch the line in the mouth due to how they swim up the river. So they won't be setting the hook every cast.

Bottom line it's still flossing.

Also the angle thing your talking about not hooking up in the dangle. When fly fishing or swinging spoons you get smashed in the dangle all the time.

[kylerme]

I don't understand why a lot of you guys hate on bottom bouncing. I have been bottom bouncing and have never hooked a fish other than in the mouth. I can immediately tell if i have the fish in the mouth. I do not even pull back and set the hook until i feel it bite my hook hard.


are you for or against it and why?

[vancook]

I'm not really going to get into it.
But you need to realize the fish are never actually biting your hook. You're flossing them.

[TNAngler]

I'm not really going to get into it.
But you need to realize the fish are never actually biting your hook. You're flossing them.

I would say for 99.99% of bottom bouncers this might be case.  There are some of us out there though that are not flossing them and still catching fish.  Much more frequently than the flossers or most anybody else.

[kylerme]

i agree with this. I tie hooks with 3 different colours of wool and i am definitely not flossing them you can feel them bite it.

[zap brannigan]

It has its time and place, I like float fishing in most cases but you can only set so deep, local rivers here aren't all that deep so float fishing is more productive, deeper faster rivers bb can work quite well.

[DionJL]

i agree with this. I tie hooks with 3 different colours of wool and i am definitely not flossing them you can feel them bite it.

I think you'd be hard pressed to convince many people around here that you are getting fish to bite your wool in the Fraser. However, there are ways of bottom bouncing bait and other lures in clearer rivers to entice fish into biting.

[kylerme]

It has its time and place, I like float fishing in most cases but you can only set so deep, local rivers here aren't all that deep so float fishing is more productive, deeper faster rivers bb can work quite well.

i would rather float fish any day of the week than bottom bounce. But all of the fish are colored in the chilliwack right now.