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[Johnny Canuck]

I would think a leader length restriction would be a good start tho. Maybe <36" or so at least help stop the flossing.

Flossing can be done with any leader length. It is the anglers intent that causes flossed fish. A leader that is 8" long would be more productive in the pockets around slab, while a 8' leader would be more effective around the train bridge.

The guys that rip at the end of their drift and during their drift should all be fined for trying to snag fish. Do that for a season or two and voila problem solved...

[cutthroat22]

Yup.
And keep the garbage-throwing, disrespectful scum away from at least the upper reaches of the river. Anglers who leave their discarded crap on the banks of this beautiful river don't deserve to fish it.
In addition to recordings of blatant fishing violations, a collection of video shots is being made of people tossing their lure wraps, roe containers and other junk while fishing, but some legal issues have to be taken care of before it can be made public on Youtube. One of the most shocking shots is of a beek discarding a full spool of thick monofilament INTO the river! It sure will be nice to put some faces to those environmental criminals.

In the meantime, I suggest everyone pick after themselves - you are being watched. But more importantly, pick the garbage to prevent the river being taken away from you. A few rotten apples always spoil it for the rest. Don't whine tomorrow when you can no longer access the river because somebody was a pig and didn't take their crap out with them.

I have videoed quite a few violators but have never uploaded them anywhere.  I really like the idea and I think the fear of public shaming is more of a deterrent than a fine.

You figure out the legal stuff and I would be glad to contribute some videos.  AFAIK it is ok to video people in a public place.

[farky]

Perhaps maybe some type of core program like for hunting, more trash bins in popular areas, mail a copy of the reg books to everyone who buys a licence. Changing the regs to suit a handful of peoples needs will never work, and sadly what you propose would have little to no effect on the garbage problem , just look anywhere .  Being a local i like having the option to go find my own piece of water in solitude where i can keep some fish if i chose, and that is usually in the upper and middle sections of the river. Go take a walk and explore there is 35km of river and the fish travel through it all. It's like going to a crowded spot and complaining when your lines get tangled and how busy it is. This is a very popular river and the population continues to grow , take it for what it is or don't go there.

[farky]

The guys that rip at the end of their drift and during their drift should all be fined for trying to snag fish. Do that for a season or two and voila problem solved...

I totally agree but those rocks feel like hits when your dragging the bottom. 

[Fish Assassin]

All it does is to make the area below the bridge even more of a gong show.

[RalphH]

I don't think a boundary change is going to 'improve' the situation. There are a lot of reasons why the V-C fishing environment is the way it is some of which can't be addressed via regulation changes.

I doubt making the river a classified water would have a big effect. Look at the Thompson for example, classified water, no retention, not a lot of fish but lots of people pony up a couple of bucks and the river gets it's own sort of crowds.

Does the river really need hatchery enhancement? What stocks are endangered? All the native stocks are healthy so the only reason there is enhancement is to allow harvest - mostly in the tidal fishery and the river fishery is a by-product and a damn attractive one at that!

The only thing that could really change the fishery to something like quality throughout it's open section is a limited entry via a pay as you go day pass. That would keep most of the riff-raff away as if it costs more to fish than the value of the fish they take home they won't bother. It would also cut down on the people who fish it every bloody day.

Of course that won't happen anytime soon if at all.

[Athezone]

Hi Milo, thats an interesting question you pose and it does open up a slew of possibilities. I agree that what goes on leaves much to be desired. Flossing, ripping, meat only hunters, litter everywhere and more people showing a total disregard for the river than you can shake a stick at.

To your first question though. I don't like nor think that changing the reg's would help alleviate the problem. The last thing we need is more rules and with the rule you propose I can see people stacked up like cord wood on the lower river. The upper then would become a paradise for poacher's with almost no one around. Yes there are C&R purists but they are few and far between.

I do love the idea of videoing abusers and poachers but the legal quagmire is the problem there. Fix that and many of the guilty party will cease to exist as they would be to busy looking over their shoulder to see who's watching them.

Making the Vedder a classified river won't change much and Johnny Canuck's right. Flossing can be done with almost any length leader if the intent is there so a leader restriction would be useless and almost impossible to enforce.

Of all the ideas bandied about I think that the best ones are limiting the amount of fish people can keep and more dfo enforcement. I feel four fish is way to many, two would be fine for most people.
We absolutely without a doubt need more dfo checking people out. I did get checked on Wed. which is great and I told them that but it doesn't happen nearly enough. Increase our licence fees and hire more of the good guys.

Keep in mind that we are all tax paying citizens and all of us should have access to the beauty of paradise and the freedom that comes with it. It is only those that use and abuse this wonder of nature that should be punished, not all of us.

[VAGAbond]

Being able to keep a good fish that I might catch is a large part of the enjoyment and anticipation of my fishing trip.  I certainly would not like to see the upper river become C&R as the lower river is sometimes just too limiting.

C&R is often a justification for snagging.  It is almost OK because it will be let go.  On the other hand, if it is desired to retain a fish, make sure it is hooked in the mouth.

Rather than shut down fishing, how about opening the river from Slesse Creek to Chilliwack Lake for C&R?

[rjs]

most stupidest thing i have heard all weekend !

[blaydRnr]

Did you also take into consideration the implication it would have towards the hatchery program? With the state it's already in and cut backs, lowering retention and creating a c&r environment would only give more reason for the government to hold back on funding. I would rather see a more proactive watch dog program put in place where hatchery employees and their volunteers can report violations to DFO and have them be recognized as a non confrontational yet accountable source of info which officers could respond to expediently. They would have the same level of authority as parking meter attendants.

As far as garbage is concerned, I agree with the blatant disrespect of some individuals, but not all blame can be put on anglers because last I checked, most of the filth I've encountered were located around most roadside campsites.

[dnibbles]

There are 4 other rivers in the Lower Mainland with big DFO hatcheries on them. Other than Cap, the others are much less crowded than the Ved. There are a buttload of other rivers without large hatchery production where you can go and find uncrowded quality fishing. Many of these other rivers have no retention, or only 1 fish. You have the type of waters you seek, in Squamish, Seymour, Chehalis, north Fraser tribs, south Fraser tribs, etc. The Vedder is the only river that offers a true meat fishery, if one seeks it. Why take that away?

Open the Vedder up to 8 coho a day, 4 springs any size. Your tax dollars are paying for them, why not get some benefit from it? These fish are there to be caught.

[blaydRnr]

Open the Vedder up to 8 coho a day, 4 springs any size. Your tax dollars are paying for them, why not get some benefit from it? These fish are there to be caught.

It would be best to save the trolling for the open seas wouldn't you think?

This thread really comes down to ethics nothing more.

[dnibbles]

No trolling. What's unethical about harvesting hatchery salmon legally? Each year ~70% of all the coho and  Chinook swim into the hatchery and end up in a fish tote. Open 'er up.

[Dave]

No trolling. Open 'er up.

Think you might have just done that nibs

[blaydRnr]

No trolling. What's unethical about harvesting hatchery salmon legally? Each year ~70% of all the coho and  Chinook swim into the hatchery and end up in a fish tote. Open 'er up.

I was referring to Milo's underlying point of view and what the root of this thread is really about.

Nothing wrong with harvesting hatchery fish...that's why they're there, but how sustainable would an 8 coho and no size limit quota be based on the numbers of brood stock released? If you're serious about not trolling then you need to rethink your numbers.