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[troutbreath]

-2, pretty well showed that there are some major concerns about pumping dirty salmon full of antibiotics. It is crazy how the rivers in Alaska are still doing well with ranching and down here with poor fish farming practices were on a continual decline.

[arimaBOATER]

Fish farms have unhealthy fish.
Viruses & fish lice are going into our coastal waters from these pens.
Wild salmon are dying before spawning.
Many wild salmon are sickly. Gills,mushy hearts,ISA is it called? ( flu )
Farm salmon sold in stores looking thin & sickly.
Fish farms putting slice & antibiotics in the farms because of problems.
Not natural to have salmon in the 1000s to be in cramped spaces.
DFO instead of looking at problems instead want to sweep findings under the rug.

What more is there to say? There's a problem Big time. Have to be totally blinded not to have any other conclusion.

Is it because in the past when there were big runs our increased population rushes to the river & want their take?
Commercial boats in the chuck,gill netters,sports fishers,natives, & it's impossible for the DFO to stop the greed.
So they concluded fish farms are the way to go,hell or high water.
The other natural method is too hard to police.

Plus as the " Good Book " says " The love of $ is the root of all evil".

Sell farm salmon to the USA to Europe wherever & make $.

Feel the frustration of all the warnings & it is falling on deaf ears.
Is it just the sign of the times.
Accept more air & water pollution,accept our food to have concerns & accept a lesser quality salmon to eat.
World gov's are concerned with major conflicts around the world & our food & salmon are way down the list of importance possibly.

Well a lot of us try to be healthy.
Excercise,eat fruits vegs. low fat milk, etc.
Surely the health conscious public should be demanding answers.

Guess there are so many problems,people are just taking the attitude " eat drink & be merry".
So do not bug me with facts, just no time for facts.

If there was no such thing as fish farms & someone decided to open one & fry got lice,viruses were found,lots of sickly fish,sold fish in stores looked unhealthy to eat...the "powers that be" would come down big time & shut that farm down in a snap of your finger.

But the fact is the farms are all set up & there's big $$$$ suddenly DFO looks the other way & is ignoring all the red flags.
Totally like evil had become good & good has become evil.

Makes ya wonder Who can we trust?
Well I know. But this is a fish site so let's not go there.

Thanks to all those who are doing the job DFO should be doing.
I'm sticking to beef & chicken & those products have their problems as well. What can ya eat ?
Hope the answer is not humans are the only thing good to eat.
Head hunters will come back in big numbers

[chris gadsden]

x2

I thought it was interesting that AM stated that she did not know if salmon farms were or were not causing harm.  A tough question indeed.

Well we know they have caused harm in other countries as the story related.
The positive of the story is, 60 Minutes did the story and took Alex's concerns serious enough to do the story as they did not spend the time and resources to send a person like Dr. Gupta to our province to cover a story.

I think the lawyer summed up the situation as it presently is and that is why our government should have come up with answer by now but I guess they really donot want to find the truth.
 
A real plus for Alex after the evening's showing in my mind.

I just saw Global played some clips from the program including the quote from the lawyer.

[aquapaloosa]

I also found it interesting that AM used the term "amongst abundant salmon stocks" when speaking about salmon farms in bc.  AM also looked disappointed when her underwater camera showed the bottom under a farm covered with prawns.  Im pretty sure she thought they were dead zones. Apparently not.

I just listened to a good interview with Ian Roberts on CBC radio.  Would you have that link Chris?

[shuswapsteve]

As expected they have Ms Morton combing the river banks looking at decomposing salmon carcasses which have been dead for an undetermined amount of time. At this point, there can be many pathogens in the fish and it is very difficult to isolate a cause of death in this circumstance.  That is fact.  A fish pathologist or virologist should have been interviewed for clarification, but instead Ms Morton is relied upon for this knowledge.  Well you get what you pay for...and it this case it is poor knowledge.  Seems like this is a caveat not mentioned in the interview.

Ms Morton never mentions the actual findings of the Cohen Commission Report on ISA and ISAv during her interview with Gupta.  Not surprising seeing as though Morton's claims run contrary to the those actual findings. Hence the creation of the propanganda film her and Roscovich created.

I agree with Dave that a lawyer shouldn't have been interviewed for this type of subject. They should have been talking to someone else with actual experience on this. For instance, the lawyer never mentioned the ISAv and ISA testing that the Canadian and US governments have done since the conclusion of the inquiry which have all been negative for the presence of the virus. He should have referred more to the actual findings of fact from the inquiry.  The final report doesn't say that there is no risk, this can never happen or we shouldn't do anything research.  It also doesn't say that fish diseases like ISA are out of control either.  It lays out what we know and what we don't know about ISAv and ISA.  Actual experts on the subject provided testimony on this.  The facts - not conjecture.  Justice Cohen outlines recommendations to look into this further; however, seeing as though who the employer is I am not surprised by the lawyer's reluctance to engage further.  This is also not his expertise so it was kind of a pointless interview.  In addition, it is never mentioned that a Fish Health Initiative is going to be started involving DFO, PSF and industry.

Ranched salmon are wild?  Lol  Funny how it is not mentioned during the interview how much of a proportion ranch salmon make up now in comparison to actual "wild" salmon.

[Dave]

Seems like a few think as we do ss, aqua ...
http://salmonfarmscience.com/

[troutbreath]

Seems like a few think as we do ss, aqua ...
http://salmonfarmscience.com/

A few people thought like Jim Jones too Dave. 

[chris gadsden]

I also found it interesting that AM used the term "amongst abundant salmon stocks" when speaking about salmon farms in bc.  AM also looked disappointed when her underwater camera showed the bottom under a farm covered with prawns.  Im pretty sure she thought they were dead zones. Apparently not.

I just listened to a good interview with Ian Roberts on CBC radio.  Would you have that link Chris?

Lots of interviews here on the pro Fish Farm site.

http://www.farmfreshsalmon.org/radio-programs-salmon-farming

[shuswapsteve]

Fish farms have unhealthy fish.
Viruses & fish lice are going into our coastal waters from these pens.
Wild salmon are dying before spawning.
Many wild salmon are sickly. Gills,mushy hearts,ISA is it called? ( flu )
Farm salmon sold in stores looking thin & sickly.
Fish farms putting slice & antibiotics in the farms because of problems.
Not natural to have salmon in the 1000s to be in cramped spaces.
DFO instead of looking at problems instead want to sweep findings under the rug.

Do you actually know what you are talking about or are you just reaching for conclusions?  Ever been on the spawning grounds and conducted enumeration and biological sampling?  Ever performed biological sampling of live or fresh dead Pacific Salmon?  Does a "mushy" heart necessarily mean that the fish died of some suspicious, foreign pathogen or could it be caused by other factors associated with putrefaction and cellular breakdown?  Do you know why scientists prefer to sample live (most preferred) or fresh dead salmon instead of salmon carcasses that have been on the banks, exposed to the elements for an undetermined amount of time?  How many fish pathologists, virologists and histologists have you talked to on the subject? What do you know about antibiotic use on BC fish farms? What do you know about prespawn mortality in Pacific Salmon - its prevalence from year to year, during the duration of the run, or between Conservation Units.  What do you know about prespawn mortality and how it relates to pathogens and environmental factors such as water discharge and water temperature?  What do you know about endemic viruses (i.e. IHNv) and diseases (i.e. IHN) off our coast - it's distribution and pathology? What do you actually know about salmon farming in BC other than what you get from Morton's blog?  What do you actually know about fish health on BC fish farms and the monitoring conducted.  Have you read the Cohen Final Report?  What did the report say about the presence of ISAv and ISA in BC waters in Volume 2?

[chris gadsden]

As expected they have Ms Morton combing the river banks looking at decomposing salmon carcasses which have been dead for an undetermined amount of time. At this point, there can be many pathogens in the fish and it is very difficult to isolate a cause of death in this circumstance.  That is fact.  A fish pathologist or virologist should have been interviewed for clarification, but instead Ms Morton is relied upon for this knowledge.  Well you get what you pay for...and it this case it is poor knowledge.  Seems like this is a caveat not mentioned in the interview.

Ms Morton never mentions the actual findings of the Cohen Commission Report on ISA and ISAv during her interview with Gupta.  Not surprising seeing as though Morton's claims run contrary to the those actual findings. Hence the creation of the propanganda film her and Roscovich created.

I agree with Dave that a lawyer shouldn't have been interviewed for this type of subject. They should have been talking to someone else with actual experience on this. For instance, the lawyer never mentioned the ISAv and ISA testing that the Canadian and US governments have done since the conclusion of the inquiry which have all been negative for the presence of the virus. He should have referred more to the actual findings of fact from the inquiry.  The final report doesn't say that there is no risk, this can never happen or we shouldn't do anything research.  It also doesn't say that fish diseases like ISA are out of control either.  It lays out what we know and what we don't know about ISAv and ISA.  Actual experts on the subject provided testimony on this.  The facts - not conjecture.  Justice Cohen outlines recommendations to look into this further; however, seeing as though who the employer is I am not surprised by the lawyer's reluctance to engage further.  This is also not his expertise so it was kind of a pointless interview.  In addition, it is never mentioned that a Fish Health Initiative is going to be started involving DFO, PSF and industry.

Ranched salmon are wild?  Lol  Funny how it is not mentioned during the interview how much of a proportion ranch salmon make up now in comparison to actual "wild" salmon.

This happens as you well know, in most news stories, they film for days and so much is edited out.

The good part it raises the awareness of this issue and more people know what fish farming is all about and the possible dangers that was shown last night and what has happened in other countries, over time.

If we could only get the government to let their scientists to do their job properly which is very difficult with the gag orders of the day we may get some proper answers. Dave is finding it difficult to get the size of some steelhead smolts released last week, a very minor issue in the whole scheme of things.

One can not blame the scientists as they face so much pressure and funding cutbacks it is hard for them to do a proper job these days let alone keep their jobs. Those of you that work or worked for FOC know that first hand.

With a change of government possible in 2015 one could hope for better in the future but I am not holding my breath. It will take many people in the environmental movement including Alex to try and preserve what we have and should have for future generations but it will be tough going as there is so many people that put dollars as the number 1 priority over preserving what many of us hold dear.

I know my simple thoughts here will not change you and others but so be it, well maybe some are changing, where is Fisherbob?

[chris gadsden]

Do you actually know what you are talking about or are you just reaching for conclusions?  Ever been on the spawning grounds and conducted enumeration and biological sampling?  Ever performed biological sampling of live or fresh dead Pacific Salmon?  Does a "mushy" heart necessarily mean that the fish died of some suspicious, foreign pathogen or could it be caused by other factors associated with putrefaction and cellular breakdown?  Do you know why scientists prefer to sample live (most preferred) or fresh dead salmon instead of salmon carcasses that have been on the banks, exposed to the elements for an undetermined amount of time?  How many fish pathologists, virologists and histologists have you talked to on the subject? What do you know about antibiotic use on BC fish farms? What do you know about prespawn mortality in Pacific Salmon - its prevalence from year to year, during the duration of the run, or between Conservation Units.  What do you know about prespawn mortality and how it relates to pathogens and environmental factors such as water discharge and water temperature?  What do you know about endemic viruses (i.e. IHNv) and diseases (i.e. IHN) off our coast - it's distribution and pathology? What do you actually know about salmon farming in BC other than what you get from Morton's blog?  What do you actually know about fish health on BC fish farms and the monitoring conducted.  Have you read the Cohen Final Report?  What did the report say about the presence of ISAv and ISA in BC waters in Volume 2?

Just a small tip, please break a post like this into paragraphs as it makes it easier to read . Thanks

[chris gadsden]

http://www.huffstrategy.com/MediaManager/release/Department-of-Wild-Salmon/12-5-14/Canadian-eco-heroine-and-wild-salmon-advocate-featured-on-CBS-60-/2966.html

[Dave]

Just a small tip, please break a post like this into paragraphs as it makes it easier to read . Thanks

The post works as a paragraph for me

[chris gadsden]

The post works as a paragraph for me

A long one then.

[arimaBOATER]

S steve
DFO staff gagged.
Fry full of lice caught in waters near the farms.
Slice & antibiotics .
Farm fish sold in stores that look so bloody sickly.
( maybe fell on the production floor & found the next day & packaged )
Labs have found viruses & instead of a "let's get to the bottom of this" it's more like a mafia sneaky sweep it under the rug" attitude.
It's all about $$$$$ & as long as idiots eat farm salmon & the $$$$ keeps rolling in the powers in charge will be like those 3 monkeys.
I see nothing
I hear nothing
I say nothing.
The Thompson River had crystal clear waters like Lake Louise color.
Today it's far from that.
Point being everything in BC is not as natural & unpolluted as it once was.
Same goes with our coastal waters & beautiful wild salmon.
Last 40-60-70-90 years MAN has used the BC waters as a garbage dump.

At 6:55 pm on the nightly news DFO heads & owners of fish farms should be filmed live eating dinner together.
Menu farm salmon.
The population will tune in like an experiment & see if the eaters after time look more & more healthy OR do does their health get worst & worst.

DFO gags their staff & in my books ....something is going on.
Where there's smoke there's fire.