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[GordJ]

The only reason that I use Bettys is because they cast farther. I used slinkys for a long time before I finally tried bettys and found they cast considerably farther.
Personally, I think your idea is fantastic. I would support you in any way possible. And I would have someone at every bar selling my own, exclusive and expensive, brand of casting weights. Your suggestion reminds me of the introduction of rabbits to Australia.
And as a reg to limit leader length goes, I am all in favour of that too. I have an idea for a 'bobber stop' kind of thing that would allow someone to cast with their weight well up the mainline above the leader and then, with a sharp tug, release the weight,allowing it to slip down the mainline to the swivel and leader before bringing the weight back to shore. I will be selling these at most of the bars too.
I don't know what the answer is to the flossing problem but I do know that knee jerk reactions aren't the solution.

[flyguy1]

I'm not a hunter but as far as I know you have to take and pass a course before your granted a hunting licence. 

The same could be done for fishing if education is to ever work on a larger scale.

IE: Identification of fish species
    How to release a fish properly
    Understanding the regulations
    Fishing ethics in general
    Enhancement and effects of leaving debris in our water systems etc. etc. etc
 
 Its just a thought but I believe it's better than to start banning certain items from local stores.  Having said that you will always have certain individuals  who decide once they have their licence that snagging is the easier option than to fish ethically.

What it might do is give the younger generation (New Anglers)  some basics on  how to make and keep fishing a far more rewarding and satisfying  venture in the future.   

[ride604]

I'm not a hunter but as far as I know you have to take and pass a course before your granted a hunting licence. 

The same could be done for fishing if education is to ever work on a larger scale.

Agreed.  Even an online course/test similar to the Pleasure Craft Operator Card could reap huge benefits with very little cost.  Could even subsidize the program by charging a 10 dollar one time fee.

[Flytech]

I'm not a hunter but as far as I know you have to take and pass a course before your granted a hunting licence. 

The same could be done for fishing if education is to ever work on a larger scale.

IE: Identification of fish species
    How to release a fish properly
    Understanding the regulations
    Fishing ethics in general
    Enhancement and effects of leaving debris in our water systems etc. etc. etc
 
 Its just a thought but I believe it's better than to start banning certain items from local stores.  Having said that you will always have certain individuals  who decide once they have their licence that snagging is the easier option than to fish ethically.

What it might do is give the younger generation (New Anglers)  some basics on  how to make and keep fishing a far more rewarding and satisfying  venture in the future.   

I'm 100% for this idea, except the downside would kill the industry behind fishing. Stores, guides, lodging would all suffer from the loss of interest of lazy people.


It sure would free up the rivers.


Maybe a simple touch screen test, or online test like the boaters license might help. You could try and cram in some last minute education. But if we can't get the DFO to restrict negative fishing practices, we will never get them to create and implement a testing system like this.


But that's one of the better ideas I've read today.

[Tenz85]

There's no way we or you or anyone person could make stores stop selling BBS. Sites are there to support the sport but there are still a business. That being said its within the regs so it will continue. Basically this is a hot topic that's been restarted after the season of snagging has past. If there is to be a change made, the dfo needs to be on board. The best case scenario I can see is a happy medium such as recognizing it a method of fishing (very unskilled method) and have it regulated with times and locations. Its like drinking and driving, it was socially accepted in the last but social acceptance has evolved. Not sure if the last analogy is bang on but feel free to comment.

[BBarley]

Somewhere, in some thread I read a fantastic idea, at least to me

Get an old box spring with the frame removed, tie a rope to it and set it up in a fashion where you don't need a scuba suit to retrieve it, but it remains invisible to all anglers, and slam that sucker in your favourite runs. When the meathead snaggers show up to floss away, quickly the run becomes unfishable. I saw quite a few "spots" on the Fraser this past summer turn into ghost towns when it became impractical to fish there due to minefields

[Stratocaster]

We can talk all we want about tackle restrictions till we're blue in the face.  Nothing will be done about it.  The only real solution is to cut off their supply of free meat.  Look, I've proposed this in the past but have not had much support.  Make Chinook, Chums and Pinks catch and release after September.  It wasn't that long ago that the only species of Salmon you could keep was coho.  The people using sockeye gear on the vedder are primarily after the easy to floss fish like chum and pink which can be in greater abundance and springs which are easier to floss due to their size and where they like to sit in the river.  Those species deteriorate rapidly once they hit the Vedder.  I've seen some dark fish kept that I wouldn't even put in my garden let alone feed them to my pets.  The only time I would kill a white spring, chum or pink from the Vedder is if its clean and I have someone willing to eat it.  Otherwise I'll let them go to spawn.  Coho are more elusive.  Sure, you won't stop the poachers or the float flossers at Tamahi but I bet you will see far less BB with betties and 6 foot leaders.

[Fish Assassin]

I'm not a hunter but as far as I know you have to take and pass a course before your granted a hunting licence. 

The same could be done for fishing if education is to ever work on a larger scale.

IE: Identification of fish species
    How to release a fish properly
    Understanding the regulations
    Fishing ethics in general
    Enhancement and effects of leaving debris in our water systems etc. etc. etc
 
 Its just a thought but I believe it's better than to start banning certain items from local stores.  Having said that you will always have certain individuals  who decide once they have their licence that snagging is the easier option than to fish ethically.

What it might do is give the younger generation (New Anglers)  some basics on  how to make and keep fishing a far more rewarding and satisfying  venture in the future.   

I keep reading that the solution to snagging etc. is for the new angler to pass a written test. New drivers have to pass a written and driving exam before being granted their licence. It doesn't stop people from speeding, texting, going through red lights and driving under the influence.

[Flytech]

I keep reading that the solution to snagging etc. is for the new angler to pass a written test. New drivers have to pass a written and driving exam before being granted their licence. It doesn't stop people from speeding, texting, going through red lights and driving under the influence.

Very true, but having them have to read and answer helps give you a chance to educate. But again the DFO would have to be behind it, and we can't even get them to restrict leader length in rivers.


There always will be idiots. But reducing the amount of idiots is a good thing.

[ride604]

If there is to be a change made, the dfo needs to be on board

I'm a bit of a noob, so correct me if I'm wrong, but all BBing that I can think of takes place in the fresh water portions of rivers.  While the DFO regulates Salmon, the BC Ministry of Forests, Lands and Natural Resource Operations regulates all fresh water portions of rivers, so if they implemented a leader or gear restriction then I believe the DFO wouldn't actually have to be on board.  Not sure if that actually matters, but maybe change would be easier to effect in provincial regulations than federal. 

[skaha]

--in a hockey game there are 4 officials on the ice... vid review of dangerous play and thousands of fans voicing their opinion of the rules...with only 10 players on the ice.
--violation of the rules often occur and many are not enforced.

--In this case if we get a rule change we will still only have 1 official to cover several miles and a ton of people so why would we think any rule change would be effective.

[BBarley]

I'm a bit of a noob, so correct me if I'm wrong, but all BBing that I can think of takes place in the fresh water portions of rivers.  While the DFO regulates Salmon, the BC Ministry of Forests, Lands and Natural Resource Operations regulates all fresh water portions of rivers, so if they implemented a leader or gear restriction then I believe the DFO wouldn't actually have to be on board.  Not sure if that actually matters, but maybe change would be easier to effect in provincial regulations than federal.

I'm pretty sure you are correct, but I do believe they work hand in glove with one another in creating/enforcing regulations. I think lobbying either party would prove to be difficult, although regulations have been changed in the past. As with any regulation change, there needs to be suitable enforcement behind it, and the DFO/CO officers seem to be at an all time low as it is. I can only imagine the grey hairs forming when the RAPP line lights up with people calling about fellow anglers with excess leader length.....

Another option, probably extremely unpopular, is to cut back on hatchery releases. Take away the steady push of fish in the fall, limit the effectiveness of the snagging. Not sure if it would work at this point as it seems there is a fairly healthy run of "wild" springs/chum/pinks that have repopulated the river, but none the less, if jacking hatchery releases can repopulate a river, surely the opposite could be true.

[flyguy1]

After searching the web  I found that Germany actually has a test you must pass before you are granted a licence   copied from   http://berlin.angloinfo.com/information/lifestyle/sports-and-leisure/fishing/                               

The fishing licence (Fischereischein) is obtained on completion of the Sportfisherprüfung (sport fishing exam). The fishing exam normally takes place once or twice a year, at different times depending on federal state.

To get a licence:

    Apply to a fishing club (Angelverein) to find out when lessons and exams take place
    30-40 hours supervised fishing lessons must be taken before the exam (lessons normally take place over 4 to 5 weekends. Information on dates and instruction is usually available from local fishing clubs and shops)

The exam tests the knowledge of:

    Different types of fish
    Fish biology and habitats
    Fishing equipment and its uses
    Treatment of catch
    Different types of waters (lakes, rivers, seas)
    Relevant legislation on fish, animal and nature protection

On successful completion of the sport fishing exam, the fishing club will issue a pass certificate which can be exchanged at the local town hall (Bezirksamt) for an official fishing licence. The pass certificate from the exam is valid for life, but the actual fishing licence has a validity of one or five years. The licence can be renewed for a fee.

Now this certainly wont stop unethical fishing today but it might bode well for the future anglers.
Make a fishing  licence suspendable along with the fine and see if as many people are willing to risk the chance of getting caught

 Unfortunately the problem once  again lies with the DFO enforcing the regulations as budget cuts always seem to hit environmental jobs first ...... Coast Guards , Rangers, Co's  etc.

Personally I think the only hope of changing peoples ways  is through education before they reach the stage of unethical fishing in the first place. I wish I had the chance to enhance salmon as the kids in elementary schools do today. I can only think of the respect some of  those kids may have for the work they put into these projects

[cutthroat22]

Instead of banning betties how about tackle shops selling river gear asking "Would you like us to pinch your barbs?"

[shuswapsteve]

A ban wouldn't work because as Dion points out where there is a will there is a way.  People already can make their own betties out of golf balls so a ban of betties from the retail stores would merely be symbolic - but certainly ineffective (i.e. a waste of time). Personally, I have very seldom participated in this type of fishery (~6 times in my whole life).  I would rather flyfish a small lake in the fall than losing a bunch of gear in the river flossing Sockeye while being shoulder to shoulder with other people.  I don't see it as being very skilled (well...I am not that great at it either to tell you the truth) or providing a great sporting experience.  I am not going to make up some story and suggest that pink wool works best and that the Sockeye are taking my hook willingly. For me, it's about getting Sockeye to eat - period.  It's not a catch and release fishery.  Those that believe it is a catch and release fishery are the one's needing help (i.e. a course) - not the angler taking his daily legal limit and going home.

If people wish to persuade others from this type of fishing method by education then go ahead by all means (that's better than banning equipment), but in my opinion there are far worse things going on than flossing.  The way I see it is that if there are more recreational anglers we encourage to partake whether it is flossing, flyfishing, gang-trolling, etc the more advocates there are to protect and enhance what we have.  More funds can be raised to do the fisheries projects that people would like to see done.  One hundred percent of the money collected from salmon stamps goes to the Pacific Salmon Foundation for things like salmon habitat enhancement.  I know there are many that don't approve of the method of flossing, but those anglers (including newbies) are not necessarily irresponsible and uncaring people.  They likely care just as much about wild salmon as those that believe they are more ethically-minded.  I believe the recreational sector is stronger with numbers (flossers and non-flossers) when it comes to lobbying for changes from government and  getting fisheries projects done than having fewer individuals holding onto their ethics with a clenched fist, being less heard and having less money to do squat, in my opinion.