Fishing with Rod Discussion Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Author Topic: Stave Question  (Read 13103 times)

Rieber

  • Old Timer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1441
Re: Stave Question
« Reply #15 on: December 07, 2014, 07:46:22 PM »

x2

If the pigs got a 1000$ ticket for littering which they must pay if they want to have their car insurance renewed, most, if not all, would think twice before littering again. Hit them HARD where it hurts the most - their wallets!

I like this idea.
Logged

capman

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 82
Re: Stave Question
« Reply #16 on: December 07, 2014, 10:00:50 PM »

I absolutely 2nd Blair. Rod is bang on. Why cant't we have politicians and law makers think and act the way Rod does?  ???
Logged

clarki

  • Old Timer
  • *****
  • Online Online
  • Posts: 2052
Re: Stave Question
« Reply #17 on: December 07, 2014, 10:15:20 PM »

I absolutely 2nd Blair. Rod is bang on. Why cant't we have politicians and law makers think and act the way Rod does?  ???
You miss the point! :)
Logged

Rodney

  • Administrator
  • Old Timer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 14817
  • Where's my strike indicator?
    • Fishing with Rod
Re: Stave Question
« Reply #18 on: December 07, 2014, 11:42:16 PM »

I'm with Rod, but a much simpler suggestion. Accountability. Technology is cheap enough now to hook up cameras in the trees with solar power to transmit video data wirelessly to a server nearby. Problem solved. Max fines and tickets for those who litter.

Holding some of these people accountable can be satisfying. I get it, we all want to see those who lack respect having a chunk of their bank account chewed away, but it will not solve the problem. You'll never eliminate illegal dumping at the massive scale. The type of people who do this is criminal and jail time is in fact more appropriate than a large fine IMO. You might deter some potential violators, but what it will do instead, is drive those few who are determined to dump further into the woods where cameras are absent. And it is those few people who are causing most of the mess. Law enforcement is important, but it's only a small part of the solution.

As for the scattered littering you see at the parking spots and river banks, that takes a change in attitude which will take a long time to achieve. There's something seriously wrong when people can bring a chair, couch, sleeping bag, tent to the river and feel like they can afford to leave it behind and buy a new one later simply because it's too complicated to carry it out. Organized cleanups can begin this educational process. Take Chilliwack River cleanups for example. The goal is not only to remove garbage from the watershed, but to ensure all the young cleanup participants understand the importance of a clean watershed, and the value of their and public properties. Hopefully that spirit will be carried on in ten, twenty years from now when they become regular recreational users.

Currently the cost of recreational access to our waterways is ridiculously cheap in comparison to most developed parts of the world. When fishing in Northern Europe, it costs me $20 to fish a section of the river for a day and a printout is given to me about rules (some fisheries even suggest tangled lines on trees are required to be reported). Access to these fisheries are equipped with information board on daily quota, maps of accessible section, and garbage cans that are regularly maintained. In this province, we buy a cheap licence/privilege to access more rivers and lakes than you can visit in one year. Information is not delivered to you, instead you are expected to find it yourself. Parking spots are road side. Access to the river is hidden more often than not, and no garbage cans or proper washrooms are installed. There's no sense of ownership, so everyone just does their own thing so it shouldn't be a surprise to see a mess left behind after a fishing season.

As for demanding better vehicle access at Stave River, this is how you go about it. If you haven't done so, join the Fraser Valley Salmon Society (or BC Federation of Drift Fishers, or an organization which you feel represents recreational fishermen best). Attend the AGM, bring up this issue and recommend to have a director in the organization taking on the task. Contact Destination BC's visitor centre in Mission (funny enough, the head banner of Destination BC's section on Mission is three fishermen doing what many do when sockeye salmon opens, so they must think fishing is important in that region right? ;) ) and voice your concern. More likely than not, Mission Regional Chamber of Commerce will agree with you and begin that dialogue with the city for you. Contact the other organizations which have members who use the Stave River, have your organization's representative set up a meeting with the other organizations to outline the problems and solutions which we want to recommend. Attempt to set up a meeting with the city/mayor with representatives of all regional recreational fishing organizations and chamber of commerce. If the mayor see value in this dialogue, then maybe something will come out of it. If not, then you can say it has been tried and there's no interest for the current city council to accommodate recreational fishermen more than what it does already.

BTW, the current mayor of Maple Ridge wanted to begin a "dialogue" on this discussion forum during her mayoral election campaign as she is "supportive of sport fishing and its importance in Maple Ridge" but I felt that it was inappropriate to do so at the time. Now that she is elected, some of you Maple Ridge anglers may want to communicate with her and see what her plans are on improving sport fishing in her city. I seem to remember reading something about the lack of shore access along the Fraser River in that area for pink salmon fishing recently...
« Last Edit: December 07, 2014, 11:51:17 PM by Rodney »
Logged

leadbelly

  • Old Timer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1601
  • Dont pitch it out, Pitch in!
Re: Stave Question
« Reply #19 on: December 08, 2014, 04:43:13 PM »

Food for thought, thanks.
I know people with Mission and Ridge Adopt a Block maybe I will throw some questions at them also.
Cheers.
« Last Edit: December 08, 2014, 05:11:33 PM by leadbelly »
Logged

oolichan2

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 22
Re: Stave Question
« Reply #20 on: December 10, 2014, 04:34:19 PM »

It's also worth mentioning that this sub $10,000 investment would pay for itself fairly quickly.

Not sure it would be that simple, you need someone to monitor, maintain and enforce even with cameras in tree's. And do we really want to give the Gov't the ability to watch us from the tree's just so a few jackwads on the Stave get a fine? Not sure I'm ready to give up my personal liberty so that the Stave stays moderately cleaner.

Don't fish the Stave or litter but do agree litter is a problem and that Rod has it bang on with expanding facilities.
Logged

RalphH

  • Old Timer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 5072
    • Initating Salmon Fry
Re: Stave Question
« Reply #21 on: December 11, 2014, 08:08:24 AM »

Well I've got concerns with the "Big Brother is Watching You!" solutions that are often offered by some folks but the fact is this is already in place in many circumstances. Tree cameras are used in many National Parks and someone who should know has told me people should be careful what they do in the wilds of the a park because you never know who may be watching or reviewing the video afterwards. A second question is how much privacy is anyone entitled to in what is a public space such as along the Stave or the BC Hydro Park? Security cameras, both government and privately operated are ubiquitous in most urban areas. Remember the controversy over security cams installed before the 2010 Olympics. Despite concerns of some groups these went ahead anyway. For the most the video material is seldom viewed except when it's necessary but and it's a big but with which I have fairly direct experience, access to material of this nature is abused from time to time despite the supposedly high professional and ethical standards of the people who have access to it.
Logged
"The hate of men will pass and dictators die, and the power they took from the people will return to the people!" ...Charlie Chaplin, from his film The Great Dictator.

firstlight

  • Old Timer
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1550
  • I'm a llama!
Re: Stave Question
« Reply #22 on: December 12, 2014, 06:09:09 AM »

ENFORCEMENT & FINES

I have always wished there was more enforcement.
However, food for thought:

Do you really think it makes rationale sense to impose let's say a $1000 fine for littering?
If we used that as an acceptable level, then I guess other fines would work such as this:

1) Speeding  $100,000
2) Texting while Driving  $75,000
3) Running a Red Light  $150,000

Driving a motor vehicle (Which most of us do everyday) is a huge responsibility.  You are in control of a "Dangerous weapon" ... that can not only KILL YOU but other INOCCENT PEOPLE.

I personally do not think that littering is even in the same ballpark.


I of course, do not condone any form of littering ...  just trying to bring a comparison into the picture.
We (as fishermen) tend to focus on what is important to us (Naturally).

However, when weighed against the BIG PICTURE of all fines & enforcement, one should take a realistic view of what can and is being done.

Havent seen a sign in a while but even when I was a kid there were signs posted everywhere that said DO NOT DUMP REFUSE or you could be fined up to $2000.00
Logged

riptide

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 89
Re: Stave Question
« Reply #23 on: December 13, 2014, 10:36:01 AM »

Logged
Fishing is not a matter of life or death ...it's more important than that