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[cdjk123]

I went out this afternoon and attempted to fish very high and dirty water (ok...I was desperate). Shouldn't have bothered. Didn't stay long.
Anyhow, I was in a fairly popular spot with about 6 guys on my side of the river and maybe 10 on the other side.

Not joking, about 80% of them were pocket flossing. Line, weight, and float. Most didn't bother with bait. Saw many chum and a few coho body snagged and some flossed. Again, many weren't using bait. Many fish retained illegally.

All were doing the classic short cast and repeat technique of flossers.

My questions are: Do these people seriously think they're ethically fishing? Do they even care? Who the hell is promoting this kind of angling?

I simply do not understand how this is a satisfying way to spend an afternoon. I would feel terrible if I fished like this.

There seriously needs to be some sort of education campaign to teach future and current anglers about ethical fishing techniques. Having the threat of a CO or DFO officer stop by just doesn't seem to work.

Yes, I reported it, but they said there wasn't a lot they could do.

[halcyonguitars]

You have to care about fishing ethically to care about ethical techniques.

Those folk likely know exactly what they're doing and simply don't care.

Ethics are just opinions, unfortunately.

[Dogbreath]

Salmon streams near large areas of population bring out the absolute worst in people.

[Rieber]

Illegally kept fish are fish kept by criminals. 

[Noahs Arc]

I think it comes out of desperation. They know it's wrong, but they're a newb and maybe they drove in all the way from Vancouver. Now they can't catch chit because of their technique so they try to line them. Maybe they catch a couple so next time they come back that's what they do. I see newbies all the time trying to fish ethically but their drifts are just brutal.

[John Revolver]

Its just a meat harvest to them.

/Dirt bags.

[243Pete]

Might also be because a lot of the BB'ers didn't get an opening on the Fraser so some of those people have now moved to systems like the Vedder to do their thing.
Seen way to much of it at Stave and certain spots on the Vedder. It's always suspicious when someone grabs their fish and before they even bleed it they stuff it into a garbage bag alive and basically make their way out, or the use of a 10 foot leader, bouncing betty 4-6oz, a small float, and the tap tap... RIP! tap tap... tap RIP!. So far I've removed several hooks from the backs and bellys of chum and it always surprises me cause they are aggresive to something properly drifted in front of them.
I really hope their start making some more regulations surrounding the use of such techniques but I hear it's already in the works cause of how stupid things can get on the river in some spots.

[chris gadsden]

I have often thought we should be putting on a class to show people how to fish properly, a good project for Rod and Kitty.  It always saddens me to see fathers out with a young son or daughter and they are flossing snagging etc. as the children will grow up doing this all their life.

An angler the other day said we short floaters are a dying breed, not sure of that as I have seen and fished beside a young angler that knew the proper way and was having success too. I asked him who taught him to fish this way, he is on this forum too, he said "my dad and friends", refreshing to see and hear that.

Many know I and others have been beating this drum for a long time but it gets worse each year it seems.

Who needs a fish that bad the have to floss, dip or snag it?

Is there a solution? I afraid not, a few reading Fishing With Rod who reads Rod's explanation how to short float etc. may change but, I hate to be so negative but there is just too many of them out there these days.

Maybe someone else has a solution that will work but I donot know how.

[RalphH]

What's with all the snaggers? I remember them as always being there. It's not a new thing.

[typhoon]

The OP is describing dipping, which is very short flossing that also results in a lot of snagged fish. It is common during high water, but also all the time in fast water areas like Tamahi rapids.

I think there are two classes of snaggers:
1. People that don't know any better. They learned from a snagger who told them that there is no other way to catch fish.
Unfortunately the act of flossing causes the bite to go off so only the flossers end up catching fish.
2. People that know better but don't care. Some meat fishers, lazy folks, guides who are under pressure to get their clients into fish.

[dufflayer]

Sorry for my ignorance; but is flossing not ehtical? In Terrace, everybody and their grandmother flosses. I learned to floss on my spey rod. Am I doing it wrong?

[typhoon]

Sorry for my ignorance; but is flossing not ehtical? In Terrace, everybody and their grandmother flosses. I learned to floss on my spey rod. Am I doing it wrong?

You're either a troll or completely clueless. I'll let you divulge.

[halcyonguitars]

I think it's considered ethical only when you can trick a fish into biting, whereas flossing is simply snagging by the mouth.

Perhaps a solution or partial redress would be to simply drastically reduce the retention limits. If you can take only one fish home, whether by shortfloating or snagging, perhaps some of these guys wouldn't bother.

Mind you, I imagine many of these same folk pay about as much attention to the retention limits as they do to ethica ,fishing.

More than a few times I've seen people limit out, disappear for a while, then come back to fish again, or scurry off to the bushes with their catches...

[spoiler]

So here's the deal!
People hear through the internet, cell phones, word of mouth that there are salmon in the Vedder.
These people do not give a Sh-t about sport fishing, ethics or whatever. All they care about is putting meat in the freezer no matter what they have to do to accomplish this.
When they drive all the way from Richmond to go get some fish they are not going to turn around and drive home if the river is blown out. They have already spent money on gas to get out there so they want to see dead fish to get their return on investment.
They are going to try to get their fish by whatever means be it flossing, snagging or whatever it takes.
That's why you see these people fishing in water that's so muddy you couldn't see 2 inches and in choke points and fast water that funnels the fish into a tight area.
That's where their technique works. Just go up to the slab or boulder run and watch people fish and you will see what I mean.
True sport fishermen know that when the river is too muddy the fish can't see to bite and also trying to fish in an ultra fast current doesn't give the fish time to bite the presentation.
Unfortunately these same people teach their kids and friends the same bad behavior so they think it's the way to fish!
I really don't know what the answer is. I have tried to talk to the offenders and shame them about what they are doing but it's a waste of time, they don't care!
I have watched the evolution of sport fishing on the Chilliwack / Vedder system since 1966 and I think opening the Fraser to Sockeye fishing is the main cause of this mentality.

[Twitchy]

Most of the flossers that I have talked to are completely convinced that salmon do not bite in fresh water and that flossing is the only way to get them... where did this start. I've even tried to have constructive arguments with them over fishing techniques, short floated a few fish up and they are still convinced that the fish I caught must have been flossed. I don't bother anymore just stay away from the flossing spots, you can't change stubborn ignorance.