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[RalphH]

I guess I know why their is no cut throat trout left in your holes now after you go though Ralph. Killing one third of them Jesus

How would you know how many are left in my holes?

There are few or no cutthroat 'holes' in the FV/LM that are subject to a bait ban yet almost every study done on cutthroat show short term mortality from c&r bait fishing is 40% or more.

I almost exclusively fish for cutts with a fly. I am under no delusions that all or almost all the fish I catch survive and are fine after release. I don't stand or hang around catching dozens of fish when that is possible like some people.

I think you like others need to educate yourself about the consequences of your 'choices'.

Exactly what Rodney is saying "the importance of catch and release is not understood and recognized at the department."

they understand it far better than you or many others. There have been many so called 'meta-studies' that have combined the data of the thousands of c&r studies done over the last 30 to 40 years and on the whole when the sort of tackle used - bait, multiple barbed hooks, the environment; saltwater fish have higher mortality, fish have higher mortality when water temperatures are higher in warmer seasons - the overall effect is mortalities are much higher than the typical propaganda published on angling websites and magazines. But I am sure you have never heard of such studies and you just swallow the tripe of that propaganda whole and think it makes you a better person than someone who doesn't take such a shallow approach.

This is leaving out the non-lethal effects that look increasingly more serious than previously imagined.

[wildmanyeah]

right....lol

[stsfisher]

How would you know how many are left in my holes?

There are few or no cutthroat 'holes' in the FV/LM that are subject to a bait ban yet almost every study done on cutthroat show short term mortality from c&r bait fishing is 40% or more.

I almost exclusively fish for cutts with a fly. I am under no delusions that all or almost all the fish I catch survive and are fine after release. I don't stand hang around catching dozens of fish when that is possible like some people.

I think you like others need to educate yourself about the consequences of your 'choices'.

they understand it far better than you or many others. There have been many so called 'meta-studies' that have combined the data of the thousands of c&r studies done over the last 30 to 40 years and on the whole when the sort of tackle used - bait, multiple barbed hooks, the environment; saltwater fish have higher mortality, fish have higher mortality when water temperatures are higher in warmer seasons - the overall effect is mortalities are much higher than the typical propaganda published on angling websites and magazines. But I am sure you have never heard of such studies and you just swallow the tripe of that propaganda whole and think it makes you a better person than someone who doesn't take such a shallow approach.

This is leaving out the non-lethal effects that look increasingly more serious than previously imagined.

Please Ralph, your intelligence is over whelming me.
 I think you like others need to educate yourself about the consequences of your 'choices'.
So what you are saying is you do not fit into DFO's 'meta studies' because you do not kill fish while practicing catch and release but all of us other chumps do. Please get off your all mighty horse and give it a rest. Until you figure out that there are many like minded recreational fisherman who practice the same kind of care for our fishery, you will be preaching to the choir. I know its hard to understand that MANY have taken the time to educate themselves on best practices/consequences as much as your self.

"But I am sure you have never heard of such studies and you just swallow the tripe of that propaganda whole and think it makes you a better person than someone who doesn't take such a shallow approach."
Yes Ralph I have read many studies, and no I never think I am a better person than anyone. But I do believe I am entitled to have an opinion, and my opinion is that these studies you speak of being 30-40 years old need some re visiting to better tell the story about guys like Ralph who do not kill fish while practicing Catch and release in a respectable manner. Maybe DFO needs to know there are many persons like Ralph out there. 
Maybe DFO needs to see that after many years of forums like Fishing with Rod talking and preaching proper catch and release methods that is is actually working. To that I swill say it again, Thank you Rodney and the many others on this forum and other forums for doing your part to help the cause.

Ok your turn Ralph.

[RalphH]

hey ... the odd thing about this group is I am unfortunately the only person who says such "shocking" things. 

BTW STS most of what you wrote is wrong and amounts to straw man arguments and putting words in my mouth. These are not "DFO" studies. DFO has actually funded very few studies of it's own on c&r.

!

[stsfisher]

hey ... the odd thing about this group is I am unfortunately the only person who says such "shocking" things. 

BTW STS most of what you wrote is wrong and amounts to straw man arguments and putting words in my mouth. These are not "DFO" studies. DFO has actually funded very few studies of it's own on c&r.

!

I am Sorry Ralph, I did not write your comments or put words in your mouth.

Thank you Ralph, I don't think i said DFO was conducting these studies, but maybe the way I wrote it would give that impression. We all know DFO spends little effort or money on the real issues but pick and choose which studies they throw around to the uneducated public.

[banx]

Rodney, thank you for your efforts in getting that weird DFO notice changed to make sense.

Also, that email was very well written.  thank you again for all the work you do behind the scenes.

[RalphH]

right....lol

Let's not forget who started a discussion with the hyperbolic title:

 HOW MANY WILD STEELHEAD DID YOU KILL THIS YEAR?

http://www.fishingwithrod.com/yabbse/index.php?topic=41849.0

rotflmao!

[RalphH]

I am Sorry Ralph, I did not write your comments or put words in your mouth.

stsfisher wrote above:

what you are saying is you do not fit into DFO's 'meta studies' because you do not kill fish while practicing catch and release[/b] but all of us other chumps do.

not DFO's studies, not my words, not what I believe

[stsfisher]

stsfisher wrote above:
not DFO's studies, not my words, not what I believe

Would you feel better if I edited my post and removed DFO's?
My goodness if only we could all be as punctual as Ralph.

[Knnn]

Rodney, thank you for your efforts in getting that weird DFO notice changed to make sense.

Also, that email was very well written.  thank you again for all the work you do behind the scenes.

I would like to second that and also mention that Dave Steele at Highwater also burned up the phone lines yesterday and kicked some well needed butt, which also probably helped with the rest of our inquiries to give DFO a much needed shake. 

So was it a mistake (as possibly suggested by the very quick reversal) or intentional..... and if the later why?

Can the dick jousting stop please or at least take it to another room.......

[Rodney]

I would like to second that and also mention that Dave Steele at Highwater also burned up the phone lines yesterday and kicked some well needed butt, which also probably helped with the rest of our inquiries to give DFO a much needed shake. 

So was it a mistake (as possibly suggested by the very quick reversal) or intentional..... and if the later why?

Can the dick jousting stop please or at least take it to another room.......

Dave has been the one responsible for getting this craziness fixed overnight. I just added some noise to bring more attention to it and keep the pressure on.

It's really important for us to find out exactly why that was changed in the first place without anyone knowing.

Thanks for pointing it out, otherwise I wouldn't have even noticed.

[Knnn]

Rod; if and when you find out I would appreciate knowing. Cheers.

[RalphH]

It sounds like this was a case of simple administrative omission & not a case of DFO failure to appreciate "the importance of catch and release is not understood and recognized at the department".

[Knnn]

It sounds like this was a case of simple administrative omission & not a case of DFO failure to appreciate "the importance of catch and release is not understood and recognized at the department".

I'm not sure it was an "omission", someone went to the trouble of changing an existing clause to something else on a Department web site, which I presume cannot be done by just anyone like Ralph in janitorial services, i.e. without some form of decision, oversight or vetting. Maybe Ralph can?

[greyghost]

Janitorial Engineer! Who would have thunk it! I thought he had his Masters in Under Water Fire Prevention!