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[Hike_and_fish]

Thanks.

We're  not the only ones. You get out there and talk with folks who fish or dont and the vast majority will agree as well. The feds are scared of FN groups. The more they roll over, the more power they gain. It's a viscous cycle.

[Rodney]

What the saltwater rec sector experienced this year is what the Lower Fraser rec sector has experienced and urged the SFAB to do something about it for the past dozen or so years now.

The decisions made for this year are already done, no amount of screaming is going to make a difference now. Moving forward, all you can do is to press for Fisheries and Oceans Canada to explore options for openings next year. It'll be very difficult to have anything reopen even if a new government is voted in after October.

[IronNoggin]

... It'll be very difficult to have anything reopen even if a new government is voted in after October.

My read is that should the current government be re-elected, we will face even more restrictions down the road (this after consulting with DFO and both fisheries critics). What we see now is locked in stone for the next five years at bare minimum.

On the other side of the coin, the Conservatives have suggested they will seek to find a fair and equitable resolution to these matters should they take over.

Good enough for me. At this point I am committed to do whatever I can to destroy the LIEberal's chances in BC. Tit for Tat as it were. Only fair after they have destroyed my livelihood IMHO.

Nog

[sumasriver]

[quote author=IronNoggin
On the other side of the coin, the Conservatives have suggested they will seek to find a fair and equitable resolution to these matters should they take over.
Nog
[/quote]

haha and i have a bridge for sale you may be interested in.........

[IronNoggin]

haha and i have a bridge for sale you may be interested in.........

Whatever.   

First time in his entire reign I have heard anything I can agree with slip out of Horgan's yap:

“Their livelihoods are now compromised because of these decisions and I know the federal government understands that,” Horgan told CTV. He went on to say, “I would love to see a compensation package for those that are being adversely affected but at this point I haven't seen that.”

https://bc.ctvnews.ca/plan-to-help-chinook-salmon-orcas-dismissed-as-unfairly-targeting-sports-fishermen-1.4392094

Doesn't mean I will ever change my mind and vote for him, but I do find it interesting that a Lefty actually Gets It.

BTW: The Feds are ducking and running as hard as they can from any thoughts or considerations of compensation. While they quite often immediately jump to the aid of those their gross incompetence pushes off fisheries in the east, out here we are simply collateral damage.

In another turn, certain well placed academics at UBC are now calling for whales to be granted the dame rights as humans. I kid you not:

Scientists and environmental lawyers agree that whales need the legal rights of personhood to give them a voice in courts and legislatures, and to secure their continued survival and well being.

https://nationalpost.com/pmn/news-pmn/why-the-southern-resident-killer-whales-should-have-the-same-rights-as-people

And The Circus Continues...

Nog

[RalphH]

If abstractions like corporations are 'persons' under the law, why not a real living thing like a whale. What would salmon management and conservation be like if salmon were persons under the law?

[IronNoggin]

If abstractions like corporations are 'persons' under the law, why not a real living thing like a whale. What would salmon management and conservation be like if salmon were persons under the law?

Should have expected that from you... 

[Steelhawk]

If abstractions like corporations are 'persons' under the law, why not a real living thing like a whale. What would salmon management and conservation be like if salmon were persons under the law?

That would mean the end of fishing for you and me, Ralph. When that happens, your act of fishing is considered homicide when you kill a fish. That will mean all organizations promoting fishing will be shut down, including this site and you won't have any avenues to express your unconventional ideas about fishing. Lol.

[Steelhawk]

If there are only 75 southern resident orcas left, why not tag them and have funding to feed them with catches from the other abundant Chinook stocks just to buy some time. Then increase hatchery production on Chinooks and allow seal cull to reduce their impact. Instead DFO rather let billions of the recreational sector lost with serious socioeconomic consequences. Funding the orcas feeding will be peanut money compared to the huge impact on coastal communities. Simple math! They can even pay whalewatching operators to do the feeding so they can make more income. Good for both humans and the whales. This can last till their population stabilizes. But if only DFO have the ball to stand up to their feared FN masters.

[RalphH]

If there are only 75 southern resident orcas left, why not tag them and have funding to feed them with catches from the other abundant Chinook stocks just to buy some time.

sounds like a cartoon. Reality is captured KWs often refused food for months. A significant portion refused food for so long they had to be released. Yet you mock me for 'unconventional ideas'.

That would mean the end of fishing for you and me, Ralph. When that happens, your act of fishing is considered homicide when you kill a fish. That will mean all organizations promoting fishing will be shut down, including this site and you won't have any avenues to express your unconventional ideas about fishing. Lol.

would it? What's more important the continuation of a species or a genus of species (like salmonids) or your right to fish? Mostly you conventionally display little interest in the survival of salmon as anything but your play thing. Your knee jerk jerk reaction to anything is more hatchery production despite the fact hatchery production of anadromous salmon species has miserably failed to meet. Survival rates for hatchery raised chinook barely match or are even lower than wild fish.

I simply asked whay might it be like and what benefits for the fish? What if humans were forced to provide them the water, environment and sustenance necessary for them to thrive?  After all corporations are 'persons' Yet they are sold, broken up and cease to be everyday and no one is charged with homocide.
But the box you've long trapped you mind inside is unable to peer out from it's imposed darkness. It's conventional thinking that has gotten us to where we are now.

Like it or not personhood for some animals may not be all that far off. Don't forget that 100+ years ago conventional thinkers scoffed at the idea of of personhood for women, non-whites and the mentally impaired. What once were 'stranger things' have happened.

[Steelhawk]

Did I say the whales be captured and raised in aquarium? No sir. I said as an urgent measure to save the whales from starvation and continue to die off, as a temporary solution to save them, is to track the known family pods down. If only a few members are tagged, like they do for tracking some great white sharks, then it is easier to find their location. They don't have to be fed constantly but during time or season when the Chinooks number is low in their resident waters. This supplemental feeding on the high seas will not harm the whales. The boats can drop the Chinooks from a distance in front of the approaching pods and so this won't encroach the pods.

This supplemental feeding can be funded cheaply if the whalewatching operators who are out there looking for them already agree to help with supplemental funding. Why shouldn't they? Their livelihood depends on the welfare and abundance of these whales and the tagging can help them locate the pods all along the coast easily. They may even do it for free if provided with the Chinooks. Even the coastal communities who, if allowed to fish for the non threatened Chinook stocks can provide some of their Chinooks to be used for feeding. It is a viable alternative during this urgent period if trying to save the whales.

This is only a creative idea to save the whales, by the collaboration of user groups who have a keen interest in the welfare of these whales, much more doable and feasible than your proposal to treat fish with human status and rights, Ralph. And this doesn't have to cost BC billions and devastate so many coastal communities. It is worth considering, at least as a temporary measure before the Fraser Chinooks rebound. Unfortunately if FN groups do not comply, as some already say so, and DFO seem fearful of FN to confront them, the Fraser Chinook stocks may never rebound.

[Robert_G]

Like it or not personhood for some animals may not be all that far off.

And no doubt the idea of it will be, or already has been bred from the left. Only a bleeding heart libtard could conceive this level of stupidity.

Don't forget that 100+ years ago conventional thinkers scoffed at the idea of of personhood for women, non-whites and the mentally impaired. What once were 'stranger things' have happened.

Interesting you use the term 'conventional thinkers'. Because you could go back all the way to biblical times, and see that the Lord taught nothing other than that all human beings are equal in God's eyes. What you suggest may have been a 'thing', but it was actually a product of evil men.....not the truth of how humanity was intended.
However.....nowhere does it suggest that animals are equal to people.....in fact the opposite is clearly taught, and if laws get made that put animals as equals with human beings....God help us all....

[Rodney]

The challenges Southern resident killer whales face go beyond the lack of food and there are many factors that influence their feeding behaviours. This isn't as simple as harvesting a few salmon and feeding them like you'd do at Sea World. To begin understanding what the challenges are, you should do some research on just how many fish each animal consumes per day, then you'll actually have appreciate and understand why your suggestion would not work.

[IronNoggin]

The misnomer that the Southern Killer Whales are in immediate peril is just that. A lie.
It has been widely sponsored by ENGO's, and swallowed up hook, line & sinker by the Agenda driven DFO.

The current population of ~ 75 is well withing historic population fluctuation parameters, and DFO is damn well aware of that.
But they have seized upon the ENGO propaganda as it well meshes with their ongoing plans. Plans which btw do not include recreational nor commercial fishers on the West Coast.

Get informed people!
I expect folks like Ralphie to continue his uninformed spiels here. Simply can't change the spots on many leopards.
That said, the vast majority of you have no excuse for buying into the horsse-pucky.
Do a little research yourself. Your eyes will soon be opened as to what is really afoot here.
Making whales have the same "rights" as humans is the latest ENGO drive, and bought into / spearheaded by lefty legal beagle academics who drool openly at the idea of pushing that forward. Fool's Errand at best.

For any that have an open and inquiring mind, I strongly suggest this is a good place to start:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Zz8aEAg7dI

Senior Science in action here folks, removing the blinders The Dino so hungrily wishes you to wear.

For those without the inclination to inform themselves, I suggest removing yourself from future contributions in this regard.
Exposing your ignorance in the matter simply points out your own biases to any that can see...

Nog

[DanL]

The misnomer that the Southern Killer Whales are in immediate peril is just that. A lie.
It has been widely sponsored by ENGO's, and swallowed up hook, line & sinker by the Agenda driven DFO.

The current population of ~ 75 is well withing historic population fluctuation parameters, and DFO is damn well aware of that.

...

For any that have an open and inquiring mind, I strongly suggest this is a good place to start:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Zz8aEAg7dI

The first 7 minutes of that video directly addresses the historical killer whale numbers.

The next time there is a news report about orcas, pay attention to the wording they use. I guarantee you that they will always add the term "endangered" or similar when reporting on killer whales.  It's quite subliminal, I never really noticed it, but after it was pointed out in the video, it really sticks out once you look for it. However it's now well engrained in the public opinion.

If you recall recently that orca who pushed around her dead calf for two weeks, the news outlets piggy-backed that very well with the endangered population angle. Good luck fighting that. Especially against a public who sees commercial and sport anglers as simply lobbying to harvest salmon for their own economic or personal benefits.