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[big_fish]

lol clarki

[wildmanyeah]

Data ( per Dick Beamish) indicates that survival of hatchery raised chinook is so low what's the point? The days of 5% to 10% returns on released smolts are long gone. Rates are 2 and often much lower. Wild fish do much better. Better to let those wild fish spawn until some more successful hatchery regime in developed.

Chinook produced out of the chilliwack hatchery are seeing above 4% returns. 

Nice to let wild fish spawn if there is water for their redds come spring, lots of redds high and dry this year when the fry were suppose to emerge.

[wildmanyeah]

'This is all optical': sport fishers slam DFO's chinook closures

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/this-is-all-optical-sport-fishers-slam-dfo-s-chinook-closures-1.5119270

[Steelhawk]

Dude, he's at work today.

Do your homework before you start tossing out "conveniently not in town", "darn minister", "insensitive politicians" (x2), "duck them" blah blah blah

The House of Commons is sitting today https://www.ourcommons.ca/en/sitting-calendar

I expect the protest organizers were aware he would be in Ottawa today. Otherwise, they aren't good organizers.
   
 

Of course I know he is at work. It is Monday, a working day for Canadians, at least for those still having a job (and many in the protest will be without one soon). He may be working according to you, but he wasn't working nor representing those BC fishermen and businesses who are deeply affected by the blanket closure. He must have known about the protest and what did he do about it? Of course, ignore them sporties, like DFO often did. He should at least show the respect to the crowd to send a message to acknowledge the concern of the people. Instead he is more concerned about the TV reporting and his public image, and wrote a email in response to a news. and yet not to the people affected. What did the crowd get in response? A receptionist. Lol. Dude, if you are happy with DFO and the minister, go ahead. But let those of us who are pissed by this organization and its head honchos express our opinion in this fight with DFO and if that doesn't fit you, so be it.

[RalphH]

Chinook produced out of the chilliwack hatchery are seeing above 4% returns. 

Nice to let wild fish spawn if there is water for their redds come spring, lots of redds high and dry this year when the fry were suppose to emerge.

What's the return for upper Fraser chinook production? That's what the topic was. The Chilliwack fish are already at least several generations removed from wild production & can't reproduce on their own. Last fall the V-C was all but empty of Chinook.

[wildmanyeah]

What's the return for upper Fraser chinook production? That's what the topic was. The Chilliwack fish are already at least several generations removed from wild production & can't reproduce on their own. Last fall the V-C was all but empty of Chinook.

all but empty? but the hatchery packed up thousands in ESSR?  Thats a good story Ralph

[redside1]

'This is all optical': sport fishers slam DFO's chinook closures

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/this-is-all-optical-sport-fishers-slam-dfo-s-chinook-closures-1.5119270

Quote from FN's is what is really noteworthy in the coverage

"Only after conservation and First Nations requirements are met should DFO support a sustainable recreational fishery," wrote Ken Malloway, chairperson of the Fraser River Aboriginal Fisheries Secretariat.

[redside1]

all but empty? but the hatchery packed up thousands in ESSR?  Thats a good story Ralph

for all these fish caught, how many first nation people actually get one to eat and just how many first nation are there on the Fraser?

[IronNoggin]

From yesterday's protest:

However, anglers say these conditions will do little to protect the chinook populations they were intended for, and harm communities that rely on the sport fishing industry. The $1.1 billion industry supports over 9,000 jobs.

According to organizers, the DFO's own DNA sampling of chinook salmon caught last year shows that recreational fishermen reeled in less than one per cent of vulnerable chinook stocks.

"Sport fishermen are the first ones that want to protect stocks of concern because we want to see them in future years," said Jason Assonities, a local fishing guide.

"We have the data that says we're not really catching them in this fishery, so why are we getting closed down when we're not catching these stocks of concern?" Assonities added.

"For us, it's pretty clear this is all optical, and it's all political."

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/this-is-all-optical-sport-fishers-slam-dfo-s-chinook-closures-1.5119270?cmp=rss

Every single time Pierre's Idiot Child can get in front of a microphone he mumbles repeatedly about Jobs Jobs Jobs.
I guess they simply don't count if they aren't in Quebec, eh?

Nog

[bkk]

What's the return for upper Fraser chinook production? That's what the topic was. The Chilliwack fish are already at least several generations removed from wild production & can't reproduce on their own. Last fall the V-C was all but empty of Chinook.

Oh please, where do you get this stuff? The main reason you don't get a lot of production out of these fish is that they were transplanted into a system that is not at all like the system they originated from. It's like comparing apples and oranges. The two are just not the same. Very little water on the Vedder looks like the rearing area on the Harrison. Might be the reason why there was never a natural fall run stock on the Vedder.
The multi generation statement is blatantly false. Capilano coho which have been cultured since the early 1970's reproduce quite well above the Capilano dam and juvenile densities in the upper river are in line with what you would see in a "wild or natural" system. The problem with the Cap is that a large majority of them die coming over the dam.

[CohoJake]

From yesterday's protest:

According to organizers, the DFO's own DNA sampling of chinook salmon caught last year shows that recreational fishermen reeled in less than one per cent of vulnerable chinook stocks.

Is this saying that less than 1% of the total fish caught by sporties is from vulnerable chinook stocks, or that less than 1% of vulnerable stocks get caught by sporties?  If it is the first one, that is not very reassuring as the impact on a particular vulnerable population can still be significant.  I notice a North Fork Nooksack Spring Chinook was among the fish sampled above.  Presumably South Fork Nooksack Spring Chinook are present as well, and those fish are hanging on by a thread.

This also begs the question - if the vulnerable Fraser River Chinook stocks aren't in the catch area currently, where are they now?  Are they in another area that is being fished?

[Dave]

Finally, FWR is interesting again

[Rodney]

Is this saying that less than 1% of the total fish caught by sporties is from vulnerable chinook stocks, or that less than 1% of vulnerable stocks get caught by sporties?  If it is the first one, that is not very reassuring as the impact on a particular vulnerable population can still be significant.  I notice a North Fork Nooksack Spring Chinook was among the fish sampled above.  Presumably South Fork Nooksack Spring Chinook are present as well, and those fish are hanging on by a thread.

This also begs the question - if the vulnerable Fraser River Chinook stocks aren't in the catch area currently, where are they now?  Are they in another area that is being fished?

Really good questions CJ.

[IronNoggin]

Quote from FN's is what is really noteworthy in the coverage

"Only after conservation and First Nations requirements are met should DFO support a sustainable recreational fishery," wrote Ken Malloway, chairperson of the Fraser River Aboriginal Fisheries Secretariat.

Anyone that wants to understand how much closed door planning happens between the DFO and FRAFS (Fraser River Aboriginal Fisheries Secretariat) have a read. Warning, barf bag may be required...

https://www.sportfishingbc.com/forum/index.php?attachments/final-letter-to-dfo-re-kamloops-forum-march-12-14-2019-pdf.45275/

Nog

[IronNoggin]

Another poster, on another Forum, who gets some of the unintentional ramifications:

"As Coastal Communities all up and down BC and especially on Vancouver Island get hammered in order to appease the lower Fraser First Nations or more correctly, a few bad actors, there is a growing realization that the Financial interests of a great many First Nations in the smaller coastal communities are also being damaged and in some cases severely. Many of their interests are directly connected to the Public Fishery and tourism. In my view they are increasingly becoming concerned about this and as the full impact of how this will harm there interests sinks in I think it will get more interesting for the Federal Liberals. In effect by completely capitulating to the Lower Fraser First Nations in an unbalanced and misguided failing attempt at reconciliation, the Federal Liberals not only turned their back not just on BC's coastal communities but also on the many coastal First Nations who are apart of those communities."

Yep.