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[bobby b]

A You cannot physically prove there is no God anymore than I can prove there is one.

Dumb logic....   

So leprechauns are ....real!!

Next time you meet him...take a selfie.

[DanL]

Atheism is as much a faith and belief system as Christianity. You cannot physically prove there is no God anymore than I can prove there is one.

You've got this backwards. Atheism is not a belief system and is actually the exact opposite.

If I claim to have landed a 800lb coho, you would be right to question it if I provide no evidence. The onus is not on you to prove that giant coho don't exist, it's on me to prove that they do. Being a mega-coho atheist requires no faith whatsoever, nor is it a belief system; it's the logical conclusion to a outrageous claim supported by no evidence whatsoever.

[Blood_Orange]

Dumb logic....   

So leprechauns are ....real!!

Next time you meet him...take a selfie.

That logic (in a roundabout way) forms the backbone to Anselm's ontological argument proving the existence of God. And philosophers wonder why nobody takes the field of philosophy seriously

[arimaBOATER]

Well I'm sure Robert_G may respond to your comments as your quoting some of his sentences.
The way Robert comments about his faith I being a believer sense he has a real walk with God.
In other words it's not so wishy washy hope so faith but in his heart he knows 1000 % the God he believes in exists & is not a fairytale.
He knows his God & yous the unbelievers scoff & try to make up a million reasons why he & I must be nuts insane simpletons religious fanatics !
Fact is we do know & you are deceived & spiritually blind.
If you ask how do you know this Jesus info is fact?
Simply I've felt His Holy Spirit ( presence. ) in my life. Invisible yes...God is a Spirit and those that worship Him must worship Him in spirit and truth. From our heart & sincerely. Not just lip service but really mean it.
A true Christian can feel the presence of God. In various degrees.
One service I was at ( only happened like this 1x in the 7 yrs I attended that church ) in a church in New Westminster had a really powerful visitation from God !
It was a Sunday evening service. A visiting speaker from the USA was giving the sermon. His message was : Do not try to live the Christian walk on your own power but live your faith with the help of the Holy Spirit. With getting the Spirit to help you will give you the fruit of love joy peace power ....
Kinda like keep the fire going by adding in wood continually ....or like electricity to the light bulb...
How does one get the Holy Spirit power? Well by doing the things that feed one's soul. Prayer...praise ...worship....reading scripture...thinking talking behaving morally...trusting/faith.
Believing what the a Word says.
If it says Jesus loves me ....then don't ask I wonder if Jesus loves me just as I am ?
Don't ask Wonder if God will forgive me if I ask Him too.
Faith or trust the Word is fact. His promises are for everyone. Do not think oh god will forgive Robert and A boater ...but not me  !
Anyways back to that Sunday night service. The pastor says that it is impossible to live the Christian walk on your own power. The weeds will start to grow back...sin pride lust fear hate greedy temptations if the Christian stops daily praying. Kinda like a tire with a leak gets flat...gotta blow up the tire with air daily to keep it inflated.
So ok he finishes his talk. Trust in the Holy Spirit to anoint you daily so your life will shine ...Galatians ch 5 tells it this way ...Flesh vs the Spirit ( or is it...Spirit vs flesh ?  )
Kinda like I want to do good but this evil side wins out.....but if you have the a Holy Spirit powering you the good controls you ...love joy peace...
In fact if you go to church & just get info about God you will be so bored & disappointed.
Like eating a sandwich with sawdust as the filling. Not tasty.
Going to church & not having the Holy Spirit ....your going to have dry boring religion ...person will say : can't stand it !!!
But if you feel the presence of God then your faith is exciting because in your heart you know you have a personal real fellowship /relationship. It's not just a dry religion or story of Jesus back 2000 yrs ago.
So.....after the evening service people talk ...get their coats ...go home...
But this time it's different .
About 25-20 of us do not leave. Nothing was announced on the mic for people to stay.
So why did some of us stay behind ?
The main pastor left...the speaker from USA left....80% of the people left.
I asked " your not leaving? No Your staying Yes ..so on.
One guy Darwin F. was attending Bible school & would get papers...to be a pastor ( ordained ) stayed too.
That 's good because he had keys to lock the church could set the alarm.
I stayed 3 hours but left just after 22 or 12:30 am because my job started at 7 am.
Maybe about 10 were still there when I left. Darwin F. & another guy left at 5 am.
So why why or what would make us stay ? God's Presence !!!
It literally felt like ya could cut thru the presence with a pair of scissors ...
The Presence of a God was so "thick" or just so present we just did not want to leave.
I mean if God was there in an extra powerful way...why leave?
This is special.
One new Christian was there ( his one arm was partly missing ) and the Presence came on him so greatly he fell down on the carpet & just laid there.
They call that being slain in the Spirit.
Another Christian lady from Jamaica but living now in Canada clapped her hands & just laughed !!!
Like the Presence of God was on her so greatly guess she just could not contain it.
But the rest of us just sat in chairs ( they were not pews in that church. ) or stood ...but just like soaked in this extra visitation of God
Darwin told me when he & other guy left God's Presence was still there in a powerful way.
But the next service everything was back to normal...sing songs read announcements sermon passed the plate sing songs service over...socialize ...go home. Presence of God there but 99% less so to say.
Not as powerful. Ha !
Like a 5hp outboard to a 150 hp outboard dif. ha ! 
Then to top it all off one pastor who was a pastor at a gov. institution job ...attended the church but he'd only preach 1x a yr maybe...he just attended like a regular church goer.
Well he did not stay that night ...but his idea was what happened must of been the devil   
Some other members had that same idea.
Ya right! God would just let the devil walk in to the church & do this !
Plus the Bible talks about Moses seeing the burning bush...
Saul who was against Christians had a bright light shine on him & he fell off his horse & God talks to him. Well Saul who name became Paul became a believer after that. He wrote a lot of the New Testament as the Holy Spirit inspired him to write.
On and on...the night I prayed from my heart in a Williams Lake in 1973 and asked God if He was real...well I had a big time encounter...no not crazy or drugs or green pickle and ice cream..
And interesting this visitation happened after a message about the Holy Spirit to be part of your daily walk living the Christian life.
God is alive & can be experience...just knowing about Him like history lesson ...well that 's dry boring religion if that 's all a person has.

[bobby b]

If you ask how do you know this Jesus info is fact?
Simply I've felt His Holy Spirit ( presence. ) in my life. Invisible yes...

Wait...what? It's fact because you 'felt' something that is invisible?

The presence of God is akin to the power of an outboard? 2 stroke or?

The Holy Spirit is .... like tasty sawdust?  Cedar?

Well that settles it then... clear as mud

Sign me up.... not 

[Rodney]

Wait...what? It's fact because you 'felt' something that is invisible?

The presence of God is akin to the power of an outboard? 2 stroke or?

The Holy Spirit is .... like tasty sawdust?  Cedar?

Well that settles it then... clear as mud

Sign me up.... not 

I wonder this approach would have worked in my biol 100 exam.

This is why Trump is so appealing to the lowest common denominator.

[bobby b]

A-Boater... Believe what you like .... it's your life. But facts are facts .... conjecture does not qualify as fact

I am of the opinion that 'religion' is the biggest, most corrupt, con game going.

[Robert_G]

And now I think about what Robert said about fishing/fish itself being an idol. I get that perspective and thanks.
There are bigger things in life than fishing. Although nothing wrong with making a career with something you enjoy such as fishing.

You're welcome...and it's true, God did design and create us to seek pleasure in this life and enjoy it....using it in a Godly way, but always giving credit to the creator....not the creation itself.
Such an easy trap to fall into it. I've been guilty of it enough times....

Exactly, they are in it for the money and nothing else.

As already stated...many of them are, but Jesus the Apostle Paul taught plainly....Real Christians cannot be like that.


1 Timothy 6:10
For the love of money is a root of all sorts of evil, and some by longing for it have wandered away from the faith and pierced themselves with many griefs.

Luke 16:13
13 No servant can serve two masters; for either he will hate the one and love the other, or else he will be devoted to one and despise the other. You cannot serve God and wealth.”

There you go...that is one major way you can tell the difference of which ones are fakes and which ones are genuine.

You've got this backwards. Atheism is not a belief system and is actually the exact opposite.

If I claim to have landed a 800lb coho, you would be right to question it if I provide no evidence. The onus is not on you to prove that giant coho don't exist, it's on me to prove that they do. Being a mega-coho atheist requires no faith whatsoever, nor is it a belief system; it's the logical conclusion to a outrageous claim supported by no evidence whatsoever.

It's not like that. The Grand Theory of Evolution (GTE) is only a very loose base theory at best. I'll tell you why that is. Just as I can't prove physically that there is a God, you cannot physically or scientifically even...prove that matter can appear into existence out of nothing. No scientist has ever anywhere on the planet, or even in a controlled experiment been able to produce matter into existence out of nothing. But THAT is what had to have happened for the GTE to be true. With that said....for someone to believe in something with zero evidence, no documentation, not even a reliable theory.....MUST HAVE FAITH THAT IT DID HAPPEN.....and if you have to have faith in something, then it becomes a belief system....and although I can't physically prove God, there is more than enough reliable evidence to support the belief in Jesus and that He was raised from the dead.

On another note ….more and more debating atheists have even stopped arguing that GTE doesn't require faith that it happened...again making it a belief system. More and more now agree that it does take at least some type of faith to believe in GTE.

So when it comes to faith and a belief system....you and I are no different in that regard.

In other words it's not so wishy washy hope so faith but in his heart he knows 1000 % the God he believes in exists & is not a fairytale.

I believe the current number of countries this 'fairytale' is banned in is currently 52.
Someone please enlighten me as to why anyone or any government law would ban a fairytale from being sold in a book store...or even owned privately.
The bible is banned in so many countries because Satan has taken over the hearts and minds of their leaders and convinced them with much deception that the bible should not be allowed to be read by people.

In the logical common sense realm....NO ONE BANS FAIRYTALES.....think about it...use some common sense...ask yourself....how does a fairytale get banned?

Wait...what? It's fact because you 'felt' something that is invisible?

The presence of God is akin to the power of an outboard? 2 stroke or?

The Holy Spirit is .... like tasty sawdust?  Cedar?

Well that settles it then... clear as mud

Sign me up.... not 

Trying to explain The Holy Spirit to an unbeliever is one of the hardest things to do. Anyone who belongs to God will give you testimony of their experience with what The Holy Spirit has done and worked in their lives. These same people before coming to Jesus would say the same things you just did.
What you are missing here is that Christians have been on both sides of the fence. I have been on your side of the fence. You have never been on my side of the fence. When I was on your side of the fence, I felt the same when Christians explained The Holy Spirit to me, but then I got saved and like every other Christian....had my own personal experience with The Holy Spirit working in my life.
Only knowing 1 side of the fence, you cannot know, nor can you argue with someone who has been on both sides of the fence. If you've only vacationed in Mexico but your friend has vacationed in both Mexico and Costa Rica.....how do you argue with him about what a vacation in Costa Rica is like? You can't. You would have no idea what you're talking about. Experiencing The Holy Spirit is similar....if you don't know Him and haven't experienced Him, then you can't have an opinion on Him....just like the guy who's never vacationed in Costa Rica can't have an opinion on what its like to have a vacation in Costa Rica.

The Holy Spirit is real and many of our interactions with Him cannot be explained by the laws of science. God transcends all of that, so He is bigger than what our minds can understand.
I can promise you this....if you do ever experience Him yourself, you will be chomping at the bit to tell others about your experience.

[arimaBOATER]

Wait...what? It's fact because you 'felt' something that is invisible?

The presence of God is akin to the power of an outboard? 2 stroke or?

The Holy Spirit is .... like tasty sawdust?  Cedar?

Well that settles it then... clear as mud

Sign me up.... not 

Talk about twisting ...tried to give example that the fishing crowd understands ...outboard engines ..
Said most of the services I attended the presence of the Holy Spirit was there but  "sensed it less" like a 5 hp. .... but that one special service when the extra Presence was in the service...like a higher power outboard. 1plus 1 equals 2
The sawdust  has nothing to do with Presence of God.
If you try church ( but not reach out to God ) you got just religion , brainwashing,programming ...like so sandwich filled with sawdust ( not tasty. ) ya got churchanity but not Christianity ...that 's why Luther protested...he said ritual or religious rules is counterfeit to what salvation is.
Wear this hat ...do this , rules ..like someone mentioned in one past post.
Saying that though have met many Protestants & Catholics who have a walk with God.
Met some I ? though ( Catholics /Protestants ) that seemed to be eating sandwiches filled with sawdust 
1plus 1 equals 2 ....simple at lest to me. Do you understand  ? 

Notice a Robert has posted as I'm  about to post.
( Hi Robert  & hi to all... Robert I truly hope these guys will be singing that country gospel song one day
" I seen the Light "  not to be confused with that other hit " I seen the sawdust sandwich "

[arimaBOATER]

I wonder this approach would have worked in my biol 100 exam.

This is why Trump is so appealing to the lowest common denominator.

Fake news ...Rodney.
Pres. Trump is not ashamed of the gospel and of The Lord.
That in my books makes him one of the greatest pres. of all time.
Do not watch those late night talk shows...more fake news.
Story ...two guys see this street preacher. Offers them two gospel tracts ..one guy takes one..other guy mocks....hey this preacher is nuts ...hear come the judge here come the judge...( mocking. ) he 's a religious fanatic...guys who preach this stuff should be locked up in a mental ward.
Giver me this track ..rip rip rip ..come on let's Go...

The 2 guys get in a car ...other guy says well guess your right ...religion is for weak people.

Other guy ..like I said a Stand on your own 2 feet ...these preachers are wackos bozos ...
Railroad crossing ahead. Passenger guy..Go go speed up we can make it ....

Driver it's going to be close...
Bang Smash Boom ...car T boned.

Next thing...2 guys are in hell.

One guy: hey you were wrong. That preacher was telling the truth !

Other guy: no buddy ..you were wrong. He puts his hand at his chin & peals off a mask ....the real identity is revealed: satan's face !!!

As Robert said: the Prince of darkness is blinding people's minds.
I think Robert & I will be praying for FWR group.
Prayer does change things & can push back the forces of darkness.

[arimaBOATER]

bobby b yes your right religion is the most corrupt con game going...
90% of religion are false/ cults....but there is the Way the Truth & The Life.
Godhead : Trinity: Father Jesus Holy Spirit
Like a clover leaf is 1 leaf with 3 leafs.
Or h2o water ice steam

Hey Rodney ya say...wonder how this approach works in your biology 100 exam!
 
Rod in that same church in New West mentioned that I attended for 7 yrs...
well there was a member named Fred K
He was a biology teacher at S. Burnaby High.
In fact he invited me to speak in the High School.
Knees kinda shock but said ok.
Guess I'm like Elvis before he went out on stage. He had stage fright. But when he got out there he calmed down and did his thing.
Anyways it was just in a classrm. Myself and another lady told our testimony.
The lady Brenda S. Once was a witch. She had a "spirit guide"ghostly figure appear in her room that could converse. ( demon) ...her ouija board would levitate off the table by itself....she used tarot cards...
But Christians shared with her the real power behind the occult.  Christians lived in the same apt building where she lived.
She prayed & got saved.
One of the most joyful talented believers I ever met she was. Very anointed by the Holy Spirit.
But get this ...one student was walking in the hallway and found out Brenda and I would be sharing our testimony from past occult to coming to know God.
This student had a satanic bible in his hands !
Thought he'd be aggressive to words us but to my surprise he went to the school intercom & announced thru out the school ( speakers in classrms and hallways lunchrm ...) Come to room ( whatever # it was)
and heard an ex witch etc ...tell their story.
Minutes later ...from 10 students ...the classrm got packed.
Ha!
Spoken in total 3 secular high schools ...a few churches...college so my speaking is limited...
But I give out tracts ...& strike up conversations...
Only when I get to heaven will I see how many people got saved thru the effort.
Maybe 1-2 or 10 but who knows maybe 100s maybe 1000s .
Like Covid 19 ..1 person spreads it to others.
Get a person saved & they get so excited they share it with others...snowball effect.
Met a mailman yrs later and he became a Christian I found out. He told me he got saved because of the info I shared with him yrs before.
One fellow wkr. at a psy. gr home I shared my testimony with...years later bumped into him in a store.
He told me he gave his heart to God. He said it was from what I shared with him.
Only happened 2 times...mailman & fellow wkr at a group home.
But that sure made my day.
God works in mysterious ways.
Robert by the way really enjoy all your points you make.
20/20 .

[Fish Assassin]

Someone should tell the greatest president of all times to tell the Governor of New York and other states inflicted with the Covid 19 to tell their medical people not to place people in ICU, ventilators, respirators. Just have the inflicted pray and they will be all be saved. Pandemic over. Everything back to normal. We can all watch hockey, football, basketball, baseball

[kosanin kosher salt]

As the other member mentioned, there’s no stopping.
Freedom of speech is alive and well on FWR, so is the criticism and gentle insults.

If it doesn’t stop I’ll assume it’s okay to make new topics including polls, non fishing related since this is such an amazing platform with many different viewpoints. No shortage of topics, I’ll start tomorrow haha

[arimaBOATER]

Someone should tell the greatest president of all times to tell the Governor of New York and other states inflicted with the Covid 19 to tell their medical people not to place people in ICU, ventilators, respirators. Just have the inflicted pray and they will be all be saved. Pandemic over. Everything back to normal. We can all watch hockey, football, basketball, baseball

Actually Christians maybe should kinda want to catch Covid 19 & die....heaven is such so good place the Good Book says...so why wait..let's die & get to heaven sooner Yippie heaven here I come sooner than later... Oh wait a dog gone minute...we we believers get Covid 19 & go to heaven who will be left to share the gospel? Who will be left to pray for guys like FA to see the light !
Who I say who I say will be lifting up the candle for all to see there's a light in the darkness...
Guess we believers are to be used to do the will of The Lord....so for your sake we'll stay longer ....
 
FA your not the only one who misses a good hockey game or the coming whenever CFL season. I do too.
But so many are dying suffering ...it 's so sad...do not even want to drink even 1/2 bottle of red wine & enjoy an Elvis concert on YT.
How can I celebrate when so many are dying with Covid 19.
Mourning for those that are suffering grieving & dying.
Let's hope this plague stops soon.

Kosher salt
If someone starts reading page 1 of this topic ....then keeps reading ....what !!! Unbelievers arguing believers believers arguing unbelievers stance they are going to be one surprised cookie.
But in these crazy times think it's good just to have a meeting of the minds.
Robert and I do not think we are better than anyone.
Robert & I got in the lifeboat ...ship is taking on water....come over here guys /dolls get in the lifeboat ..lots of room. We share because we want you in heaven with us. John 3:16 Ephesians 2:8&9 free gift.
Way out.

[big_fish]

Why don't you write another essay

FFS lol... again, I pity those who have to deal with you 24/7, imagine the amount of energy and time wasted listening to that