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[wildmanyeah]

It will happen for the sake of "angler satisfaction", people whining they had to let one go so they could keep for fishing for the entire day.

From what i can see on social media the vast majority of people want it to stay at 1/day. So if it goes to two a day its going the because the province wants it to not the fishermen.

[Hike_and_fish]

Terrible rule change for the Chehalis. Theres already a big problem with poaching in the upper sections of this river. Over the past 3 years I've seen more anglers in the mid to upper sections AS WELL AS wild Steel being taken. Ive called the RAPP line each time and reported each incident. I feel that with a regular change, it'll make this problem worse. Just this September I saw a boat come into the camp site at the lake with ( what looked like ) a 10 pound Chrome wild Steel. Sure ot was probably a summer heading into the upper river and probably shouldn't have been there to begin with but my point is, poaching is a serious issue on the Chehalis.

[RalphH]

For the V/C I am less convinced by the 'overcrowding' argument than I was at the outset of this discussion. I don't think it's a good thing for hatch fish to spawn with wild fish.  I also don't believe social media is necessarily representative of the responses Government will get. Advocacy groups such as the BCWF will no doubt organize their members to respond in favor.

[wildmanyeah]

Advocacy groups such as the BCWF will not doubt organize their members to respond in favor.

Yes don't discount the sportfishing industry reps and their ability to control the narrative.

[DanL]

This was posted in the proposed Chehalis reg changes

Rationale:
The current regulation was enacted for the 2000-2001 Synopsis for the purpose of “alleviating crowding” on very heavily fished hatchery-augmented steelhead waters (e.g., Chilliwack and Chehalis rivers). At that time, it was determined that angling effort on these streams had reached a point where there would be an adequate harvest of hatchery fish at the 1 fish quota to ensure reduction in interactions between hatchery and wild fish.

The ongoing angler survey on the Chilliwack River indicates that many anglers release hatchery fish because they do not want to have to quit fishing. It is assumed the same applies to anglers on the Chehalis River. Given current low numbers of wild fish and a greater understanding of potential adverse effects of hatchery fish on wild populations, it may be important to reduce this effect through increased retention of hatchery steelhead. This regulation, in combination with education of anglers, should help increase removal of hatchery fish.

Additional Information:
Annual creel surveys have been conducted on the Chilliwack River through the River Guardians program since 2018. Changes to fishing regulations (specifically increasing the daily quota of hatchery fish) was one of the top 3 most common comments shared by anglers. Analysis of 2018-19 creel survey revealed that approximately 58% of hatchery steelhead landed were released, 50% of which were released specifically because the angler wanted to continue angling that day. In addition, 25% of respondents who claim to routinely release hatchery steelhead, do so to continue fishing. It is assumed that anglers on the Chehalis River would express similar opinions.

Seems like they've been receiving this comment a lot. The meat doesn't really matter to me, so if I caught one early in the day, I wouldn't retain it either. Though I'm surprised that it's as high as ~60% of hatchery steelhead are released. Though if relatively few hatch are making it to the staging/spawning areas (which others here have suggested), then that would imply that most are eventually harvested by someone (or C&R mortality is higher than expected), which also implies that nearly all wilds will be caught/released multiple times.

If by increasing the retention to two is also an effort to reduce hatch fish making it up, would that not also increase the bycatch effect on wilds. Though I guess the earlier upper closure will mitigate that. And it sounds like there is particular concern with hatchery-wild interbreeding, so measures that might reduce that are ultimately beneficial.

As far as the quality of the fishery goes, increasing limits to 2/day is not likely to 'spread the wealth'. The top skilled anglers are likely to catch and retain more, leaving fewer for the casuals, like me. It's obviously not like salmon season where there's usually plenty of numbers for everyone. I would expect the chances of success of most anglers to decrease with a 2/day reg.

[RalphH]

Very good post DanL. Thx!

[Roderick]

More hatchery fish spawn then people think. I personally catch a dozenish clipped mending fish (almost always female) every season.

Yes and they all spawn at or below the hatchery, leaving the whole upper river for the wild fish.

 

It will happen for the sake of "angler satisfaction", people whining they had to let one go so they could keep for fishing for the entire day.

It's the scenario of three people fishing together.  One catches a hatchery fish right away and has to sit in the car for the rest of the day or convince his buddies to go home.  Causes whining to happen I would think. 

[RalphH]

did you read the part that few steelhead spawn above the hatchery and by far most spawn between Tamihi and Slesse Creek? I have seen the odd pair below Tamihi. As for the 3 guys in the car ... most people I see are angling solo. A good number are a duo. Not too many are 3 or more.

There certainly have been good points made in favour of raising the limit to 2 though you seem to think better we gets lots of hatchery spawning so why raise it (?)

[stsfisher]

Question for the guys who do or have worked the Chilliwack hatchery.

Are hatchery steelhead allowed to spawn in the channel and head out naturally on their own?
If Not, At what lengths does hatchery staff go to to ensure no hatchery fish are spawning in its channel? And lets include that portion of Slesse creek as part of the hatchery channel as presumably those hatchery fish making their way back would utilize that section.

[Dave]

I'll let buck have this one 

[Every Day]

There's a scenario here that everyone seems to be missing out on.

This exact same thing (creel finding high release rate of hatchery fish due to anglers not wanting to stop fishing) happened on the cowichan. They cut that program. When a program isn't being used as intended, there's no need for it (especially with the concern surrounding hatchery genetics mingling with wild). Personally, I'd rather see a rule change than losing it outright.

Based on those creel results on the chilliwack/ Vedder since 2018, my feeling is that this is an effort to convince anglers to kill some hatchery fish (prove utilization of the program/ Stop hatchery steelhead from spawning). If the creel continues to find that hatchery steelhead are being released, even after increasing to 2/ day, it probably wouldn't be a good thing based on history. If everyone petitions to keep it at 1/ day,  and creel continues to find high proportions of hatchery being released, the results would also probably not be good.

At the end of the day, a 2/ day limit would definitely increase retention. I don't really care for steelhead, and tend to release all my hatchery fish, especially if it's 1/ day.  On 2/ day rivers,  I often find myself killing my first one to hand as a gift for a friend, and continue fishing. Sometimes if it's near the end of the day I'll even kill my 2nd. With the huge number of people starting to drift the C/V now, there's no doubt that people will retain their first and then fish the rest of the day. Right now they'd definitely release the first.

[stsfisher]

I'll let buck have this one 

👍

[GENERAL-SHERMAN]

I don’t think there is that many people releasing hatcheries. It’s probably less than 10% of the anglers and or releasing rats and small bucks .At least In the early months. I rarely see hatcheries released. Especially on the Mid and lower stretches where retention seams stronger.  The percent of catch and release may go up later in the season when fish colour up though.. Lots of hatcheries make it through when the water Bumps and then become untouchable when they reach the hatchery . It would be nice if the hatcheries could Maybe round up and release these fish back in the canal to increase the odds of being caught the second time through. Sts Fisher makes a good point about hatcheries spawning above the boundary and in slesse creek channel. I think the 2 fish a day is counter intuitive when wild fish will be hooked more often as a result of more angling pressure. With the number of tubed wilds pairs bumped down there is going to be less hatcheries returning already.

[Rodney]

How about we make it two hatchery fish per day above Tamihi until March 31st before closing it, and just keep it one hatchery fish per day below.......

I almost never see hatchery fish being released in the lower river. Dan makes a good point on drift trips though. They are likely to release any hatchery fish early on and only retaining fish near the end of the drift, but we are still only talking about a small % anglers in comparison to the number of foot anglers from the upper boundary down to mid river.

Dan's also right that if the province concludes that a significant number of hatchery fish are not being harvested, then you may see the hatchery program being cut. The FV hatchery cutthroat trout program was not exactly cut due to this, but the low harvest rate was a big concern for managers before the program was discontinued.

The % of hatchery fish harvested really are just speculations without much data to back it up. There are too many uncertainties in surveys done by river guardians, the mailed in questionnaires are not really that much better. There has to be a better way to collect concrete catch data... not just for steelhead, but for other species too. This would only benefit recreational fishers, and the fish.

[Every Day]

I don’t think there is that many people releasing hatcheries. It’s probably less than 10% of the anglers and or releasing rats and small bucks

So, you're assuming that people are lying to creel surveyors then?

"Analysis of 2018-19 creel survey revealed that approximately 58% of hatchery steelhead landed were released, 50% of which were released specifically because the angler wanted to continue angling that day. In addition, 25% of respondents who claim to routinely release hatchery"

I know a number of people that release hatchery fish near the start of a day to keep angling, but would gladly retain that same fish after a few hours out/ near the end of the day. The 2/ day has existed on the island for a long time without issue.

Once again, for the last time, biologists often will make decisions based on creel. The question should be, "would you rather allow this regulation change, or potentially lose the program (that isn't being "utilized") outright?"