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[Gooey]

One excellent point was made...why not target humpies too.  The simple answer: becuase they are worth a fraction of the price of a sockeye (whole pink in save on: $5.00, whole soc: $35).

The courts need to be made aware that really what they are talking about when they say people relie on the sockeye...they mean the cheam relie on the $$'s from the ILLICT sale of sockeye caught under the guise of cerimonial and food fish!

BTW...how much do they actually need.  one point they ask for:

"An injunction against John Doe and Jane Doe prohibiting them from carrying out the 2005 Sports Fishery in the channels specified in Schedule "B" to this statement of Claim during openings of the Aboriginal Fishery authorized by the Department of Fisheries and Oceans"

there are plenty of other bars we can fish outside of the requested area, I thinkity makes sense to minimise a sport presence during the FN openings.  Frig, let them fish hard for a week or 2, watch every frigging boat and net...count every fish they catch,  then get them the F*** outta the water once their quota is filled. 

[Old Black Dog]

Gooey, sounds good, however if they get this one watch them and others go to court for more.

This can/ could be the thin edge of the wedge!

[pepsitrev]

  good point black dog give them an inch and they want a mile.  but i think the rec anglers hands are tied at this time as the fns have more rights to fish for ceremonial purposes than we do. we just have to wait and watch the outcome of all this .

[Gooey]

I think its time the smoke screen known as "cerimonial and food purposes" gets blown away and the truth comes out...

BTW my dad was reading an article in either the sun or globe and apparrently the cheam have 300 members!  I wonder how many fish they figure they need for "sustinance"?!?!

[pepsitrev]

yep and how many get sold to the public illegally

[Sorsha]

I have heard several discussions on CKNW with Cheam leaders about what the Cheams want and think.  Even though its is illegal for the Cheam to sell fish that they catch for "Food and Cerimonial purposes" the Cheam actually feel that because their people can't survive on a diet of Fish alone they are justified in the selling or trading of surplus "food" salmon in order to purchase other food products.  Rather convoluted thought pattern but whatever helps them sleep at night. I have fished just down river from where their big shelter is just east of the Agasiz Bridge and was shocked at the amount of guts and heads that were floating downstream.  When they are running at full steam pulling nets and bringing in their catch to the beach to be gutted the water is full of guts!  That is not fishing that is more like the forebringer of the extinction of the Pacific Salmon.  And yet the FN want to blame us for over fishing!  A joke to say the least.

I ask all of you what is your total yearly catch of sockeye?  Let us see what the average heavy duty sport fisherman's take of sockeye actually is and compare that to the "reported" take of the Cheam.  Some of us go fishing everyday and some of us go everyweekend, and some of us like myself go maybe 3 times a season.  I have a family of 6 and in the last 3 years we have only taken 6 sockeye and the equal amount of pinks and 1 jack spring.  So I can tell you that my family is deffinately not over fishing!

[Gooey]

"Cheam actually feel that because their people can't survive on a diet of Fish alone they are justified in the selling or trading of surplus "food" salmon in order to purchase other food products".  Does beer or a "new" old beat for the front yard count too?

Screw them...they want to sell the fish, get a COMMERCIAL LISCENCE and stand in line with the rest of the commercial fishermen in this province.  Having a food fishery get priority is one thing...having a priority FN commercial fishery is DISCRIMINATION (and has already be struct down by the courts)!

[chris gadsden]

Gooey said


there are plenty of other bars we can fish outside of the requested area, I thinkity makes sense to minimise a sport presence during the FN openings.  Frig, let them fish hard for a week or 2, watch every frigging boat and net...count every fish they catch,  then get them the F*** outta the water once their quota is filled. 

Just arrived in Edmonton, a good flight out and excellent view of the Fraser River as well. I donot know if it was good timing or not to be away. However, Gooey if you read the injunction carefully they want you to ask permission to fish in their territory, anytime. I imagine they will want money for it also. A number of incidents have happened already as they came ashore asking anglers to leave, some were given paper as well telling them this was their territory. Others I was told were given the injunction papers as well.

This will be only the thin edge of the wedge, let me tell you if they get this. Letter writing time, Rodney has posted the information you need. Phone calls especially to your local MLA telling them of this concern is very important. Try to do it now before it is too late.

I have made contact with the two MLA's in Chilliwack who are both in cabinet, so it is now your turn. Please do it now.

[Old Black Dog]

Cheam band tries to shut out anglers
First nation seeks Supreme Court injunction to bar recreational fishing in natives' traditional areas on Fraser
 
Scott Simpson
Vancouver Sun


Thursday, August 04, 2005


 

 

 
 
FRASER VALLEY - Fraser River anglers are being confronted on the banks of the Fraser River by members of the Cheam First Nation who want a prohibition on recreational fishing in a traditional aboriginal fishing area near Chilliwack.

Band members are handing anglers a package of documents that includes copies of a statement of claim that Cheam Chief Sidney Douglas filed July 20 in B.C. Supreme Court.

The claim asserts that the band's aboriginal fishing rights include "the exclusive right to use and control access to the fisheries in the Pilalt Title Area, including the sockeye fishery."

Pilalt was the original tribal group from which the Cheam are descended.

"Of course I don't like it," said Fred Wardroper, owner of Chilliwack Darts and Tackle.

"I don't know how you can close parts of the river for another user group. The people that have come into the store with these papers are not happy at all. I don't think they are intimidated. It just doesn't seem right."

As well as the copy of the statement of claim, anglers are being handed a letter from the Cheam's lawyer that advises that the band is seeking a Supreme Court injunction that would immediately bar anglers from angling in areas of the Fraser where the band operates its federally managed food fishery.

Both documents name John Doe and Jane Doe as the targets of the legal action, with those identities referring to "persons unknown who are and who are expected to be engaged in a licensed recreational fisheries [sic] for salmon on the lower Fraser River in July and August 2005."

Spokesmen for Fraser Valley sport fishers, guides and tackle shops said they are deeply disturbed by the Cheam's action and warned that it threatens both the common property rights that belong to all Canadians as well as a large portion of the Chilliwack tourism economy.

Douglas did not respond to The Vancouver Sun's request for an interview.

Cheam legal counsel Robert Janes described the injunction as an interim measure, limited in scope, that is only intended to allow the Cheam food fishery to proceed without having to manoeuvre around sport fishing lines and boats.

"There are five particularly critical [river] channels that are used for drift fishing and essentially we will be asking the court to have the recreational fishermen barred from those channels while the Department of Fisheries and Oceans opens the Cheam aboriginal fishery," Janes said.

In its statement of claim, the band said "overcrowding" by sport fishers diminished the volume of its sockeye catch in a July 23 food fishery, and it wants the authority to forbid sport angling in the area unless anglers have first sought and received Cheam consent to use their aboriginal "title area."

"It would have huge impacts on the economy in Chilliwack," said Frank Kwak, vice-president of the Fraser Valley Salmon Society.

Kwak noted that anglers come from all over the world during the summer and fall months to fish the Fraser, particularly around Chilliwack, for salmon and sturgeon.

Added Dean Werk, president of the Fraser Valley Guides Association: "This news is spreading fast.

"When it gets to the European world you are going to see cancellations and more cancellations and this will be devastating to British Columbia.

"Is this province open for business, or is it not?"

© The Vancouver Sun 2005

[allwaysfishin]

reports from customers today saw FN fish sales in mission , agassiz and Hope. sockeye at all three locations were selling fresh from the cooler for 12.00 each.
These Cheams can kiss my freakin my buddy and DFO has lost ALL credibility.
I smell "Sport/recreation" protest fisheries on the horizon and YES, i'll be at the front of the line.
more to come on this action soon.
My days of buying freshwater liscences and conservation surcharge stamps are coming to an end.

[DragonSpeed]

reports from customers today saw FN fish sales in mission , agassiz and Hope. sockeye at all three locations were selling fresh from the cooler for 12.00 each.
These Cheams can kiss my freakin my buddy and DFO has lost ALL credibility.
I smell "Sport/recreation" protest fisheries on the horizon and YES, i'll be at the front of the line.
more to come on this action soon.
My days of buying freshwater liscences and conservation surcharge stamps are coming to an end.

I hope they were all called in.  If people had cameras, then pictures would go a long way too!  We need to shove this in the faces of the top DFO/ministers and say "Look!  They're SELLING the freakin' fish - NOT eating them!!!!!!"

[pepsitrev]

well put dragon i think i might take a drive with my camera and snap a few pics . hopefully i dont end up in a confrantation with the natives.

[Bantam_50]

I'm really surprised everyone is so taken aback by this and didn't see it coming.

Quick rant ...

 How many didn't hear about the FN bands that weren't allowing any non-FN moose hunters into regions west of Williams Lake last fall. They set up blockades on roads ... basically checking all travelling moose hunters. They also put forth an injunction to stop all moose harvest of immature bulls, which WLAP had reinstated into the general hunting season for 2004. Well you guessed it ... WLAP closed the immature season down and some hunters who had invested their holidays and money got screwed. Again this season the same bands have gotten WLAP to close the immature season down prior to the regs coming out. Why did they do this you ask ... they stated there was insufficient moose numbers to allow a general immature bull season even though WLAP biologists count showed otherwise? These bands claimed that it impeded their ability to harvest their winter meat because they felt moose population numbers were down. A large contributing factor was that these bands got squat in their food fishery last season due to the Chilko slide and the disappearing Fraser stocks. So they now they work with WLAP in setting general hunting seasons for all British Columbians ... and are content, for now.

Getting back to the Cheam band ... WHY wouldn't they file this injunction. We all pretty much pissed on them for the loss sockeye stocks of 2004. They seen how and what the Interior bands got. Whether out of spite to sport anglers or just greed they're just following suit.  Heck ... I'm going to tell you all this is just the beginning. You haven't seen anything yet. And will the courts and/or Victoria do anything about it? "Can you say Whistler 2010"

The FN bands across BC have a powerful hold over the powers to be for the time being by the simple suggestion of an Olympic boycott. So in the meantime they'll be allowed to get their own ways. After all, who's being inconvenienced ... just Canadians.

[chris gadsden]

Was there anything else in any papers or other media other than the Van. Sun. As in Edmonton isolated from the BC news. If anything gets on TV today or the next few days if someone could try to tape it for the SDA files that would be appreciated. Thanks

[Old Black Dog]

Chris. Bill was on CKNW last night and it was on their news then, but gone today!
I expect something in the Chilliwack paper next time!