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[rerigger]

spending to much time on the oean there ?
you witnesssed a full blown native food fishery in action

[blaydRnr]

just finished watching ctv news. they had the chief of the cheam band admitting to, its members fishing outside of their designated openings and then selling sockeyes illegally. he added, other bands are also partaking in these illegal activities. still no representatives of DFO have gone on record to address this serious matter.

further more warnings to the public were given to remind us that buying fresh sockeye, is illegal.

really? i guess i should call the cops to raid saveon foods, safeway, and superstore.. they all advertise fresh sockeye 'for sale' 

also looks like the protest movement is starting to pick up steam. organizers are giving dfo one last chance to make things right. civil unrest is inevitable.

[Fish Assassin]

I'm sticking my neck out to predict a commercial opening. DFO always cave in whenever there is a protest.

[blaydRnr]

As to the Comment about SaveOn and SafeWay those fish are from Alaska!  Not from around here.


C.F

fair enough, but they were very vague in their criteria.  most consumers don't know the difference and the stores don't specify where the fish were caught.

[Rodney]

fair enough, but they were very vague in their criteria.  most consumers don't know the difference and the stores don't specify where the fish were caught.

Most media don't know either.

This whole situation that we are in right now, is often fueled by misinformation or the absence of information. Since the beginning for this year's FN fishery, we have urged DFO to provide us information on how the FN fishery is managed, who the monitors are, what are the quotas given, and the process of reaching that agreed quotas. I think tension would be eased a lot more if the information is more readily available to the public. The angling community isn't that much better either. There isn't a centralized communication tool that delivers message effectively to all anglers. We are not organized, as OBD has mentioned earlier. We are fragmented by our fishing preferences, etc. A lot of time we express our wishes based on what we see and hear, instead of hard facts and scientific findings. A 20lb chinook at the river can turn into a 40lb tyee by the time the words reach the tackle store. People need to calm down a bit and identify exactly what the problems are.

During last Tuesday's dialogue session with the Fraser Valley First Nations, Cheam's Chief Sid Douglas (who you saw on CTV last night) walked in late and announced that they are no longer involved with the dialogue sessions due to the negative publicity we have given them in the media and walked out. On a more positive note, we still have three bands who are very willing to see the issues resolved with the Sportfishing sector, they are Yale, Chehalis and Skwah.

The reported observations on the Lower Fraser FN fishery that Chris, Nina and I made last weekend have been circulated by email. I've been told by one sector of DFO that the findings are false and I will be provided with information how these fisheries are managed next week. I look forward to the reading. I have also been contacted by another sector of DFO, who is very interested to go over the photos and videos that we have captured.

The problem is not that easy. Shutting out the FN fishery is not the answer. We have three sectors that utilize one resource. Understandings and compromises have to be developed to satisfy all groups. I firmly believe that by pointing out the problems and pressuring the management to provide answers and solutions to those problems, we will reach that ideal system to accommodate everyone without damaging the resource.

[Wool Bandit]

Where and when is the sportfishing protest going to take place?

[Gooey]

As most of you know I have an ex psc panel member that I have been talking with.  He has been very insightful despite the fact that he has been off the panel for several years.

One thing he asked me was who the recreational fishing representative was on the PSC panel.  We are supposed to have (and at one time did) have representation on this panel.  Does anyone know if we have a representative adressing our interest on the panel?  If so who ary they, how can we communicate with them?

Another huge point he made is really the FN fishery is as segrigated within itself as is the FN,commercial and sport sectors.  I asked him why would they have a marine opening if they are concerned with interception of late run fish...why not have all the openings up river?  Apparently FN fisheries are allotted based on historical access levels. as an example the cowichans probably fished the lower river in majority...now the cheams apperrently dont want other bands fishing that part of the river as its their historical territory. DFIO is then forced to allow various tribes to fish in only certain areas and depending on that tribe and its equipment, there could be further complications to where they can fish.

This is a hugely complex issue that revolves (IMHO) mostly around the FN fishery management.  Just like the FN hides most of the fish they catch and it slips thru the cracks,....I think the cock ups we see with DFO are the tip of the iceberg - i think they hide a vast majority of the political and burauecratic bs too.

Where to go from here tho?  Thats the million dollar question.  But Rod was right in saying more disclosure and greater transpanancy would go a long way.

[allwaysfishin]

after reading all the comments and seeing how helpless sporties are to defend our rights of access, I will be fishing this year from this day forth as an aboriginal (Metis), guaranteed my right to harvest for food by the canadian constitution AND the recent Powley decision, regardless of wether the Canmpbell government chooses to recognize the Supreme court Powley decision. I have to date this year killed two fish, 1 a 37 lbs red spring and 2 a 18 lbs redspring. No where near enough for my sustanance needs for this winter.
I urge ALL fellow Metis to stand and excercise thier rights in this Province.
And I urge all sporties to rise and defend thier rights as well.
I will be taking an undisclosed sockeye and spring catch and will be prepared to face this countries courts to defend my right of harvest, as both a sport fisher and a Status carrying Metis.
This past week has taught me a lot about the status quo in this country, sometimes I'm ashamed to be canadian...... this is one of those times.
In a country that force feeds it's citizens multi culturalsim and equality, these are sad times.

[Steelhawk]

Yesterday, I went targeting springs in a upper Fraser bar. There were soooo many sockeyes, hooked, jumped, rolled, everywhere for the whole time I stayed.  They were way, way, way more than the last few years.  A green rod below me could not cast properly, still learning to cast far.  Most of his casts were within 30 ft from shore.  He was into sockeyes non-stopped the whole afternoon. I tried to tell him to cast further to avoid them, but he couldn't cast far nevertheless.  By the way, he had 3 pinks on the beach when I left. Every one is following DFO's ruling to release sockeyes, mostly in the water too.  But it is surely sad to see law abiding sporties denied the abundant sockeyes while FN are the only ones entitled to catch these fish, legally or illegally.  It angers me to see such inequality & unfairness in this free, great nation of ours when it comes to fishery management.   What does it take to change DFO's unfair approach.  How many years will it take to right the wrongs in their corrupted approach?  A FN member killing 50,000 socs, worth the entire catch total of the sporties in a regular season, and yet none of us is allowed one sockeye. Why? Why such an injustice and inequality is allowed to happen.  Fishermen, make your vote count in the next election!!!

[allwaysfishin]

AN UPDATE TO FUTURE INEVITABLE SPORT PROTEST.
Though at this point I am not taking the lead on this, I am in contact with those who are.
Details will be revealed this coming week either monday or tuesday.
Berry's Bait telephone report line will be providing information in the coming days (604 638 5899)

PLEASE TAKE NO ACTION UNTILL AN ORGANIZED EFFORT HAS BEEN PUT TOGETHER.
I will tell you this, it's in the works as we speak.
Those from SDA or other groups representing Fraser fishing opportunities (and other fisheries) may contact Mike Berry at 604 273 5901 to express thoughts on this.
you may also email to berry@berrysbait.com

I am not sure who else out there is providing an information service such as Berry's is, but for the time being the fishing report that we pay to have availlable for anglers to access for free will be a source of straight up info during this conflict. Pass the number on and get informed.

[Old Black Dog]

So, you are really going to look stupid if you do not address these questions!


And what will be the gain of a protest fishery?
What is the point you are trying to get across?
Who will be the spokesman?
How will it look to the general public?
Will DFO actually listen?

[Steelhawk]

So, you are really going to look stupid if you do not address these questions!


And what will be the gain of a protest fishery?
What is the point you are trying to get across?
Who will be the spokesman?
How will it look to the general public?
Will DFO actually listen?

1. A protest fishery is just that, a protest of the unfair & unjustified fishery management pratice of DFO.

2. The point to get across is that the other sectors beside FN are extremely unhappy about the biased approach of DFO management style in which one group (FN) gets to fish all they want without proper monitoring and accountability.  DFO fails to act to protect the fish (when they declared stock was low & turned around letting FN drfit netted sockeyes weeks & weeks), and fails to provide a fair opportunity for the other sectors to fish when sockeyes show up in much larger number.

3. Who will be the spokesman?  Hopefully some person of influence will lead the charge.

4. The public should sympathize with the sports & commercial sectors when they are informed of the truth, the unfairness, and the ugliness of 'food fish' exploitation. We should inform the public that ordinary citizens should be entitled to fish when there is evident of surplus stock. It is time people should be informed that 'white guilt' does not justify all the greed in the FN fishery.

5. Will DFO listen?  Does that matter?  It is a protest of our anger & displeasure of their polciy.  It is the public pressure that they will have to deal with.  If they ignore pulbic pressure, then hopefully, it will reflect in the next election.  Local liberal MPs will have to face the consequence of turning a deaf year to public sentiment.

[blaydRnr]

So, you are really going to look stupid if you do not address these questions!


And what will be the gain of a protest fishery?
What is the point you are trying to get across?
Who will be the spokesman?
How will it look to the general public?
Will DFO actually listen?

1) it'll give 'faces' to the voice of those who are seeking justice.

2) it will attract media attention and bring awareness to the canadian public of the current crisis and allow them to see and hear (first hand), the lack of government response to our every growing concerns.

3) there will be more than enough, well articulated spokesmen, who will rise to the occasion. these protests are being carefully orchestrated to maxime its effects while minimizing any negative impacts.

4) the goal is to be 'passive resistant', yet defiant. public awareness is the key, facts will be laid out and the corruption will be exposed.  a 'black eye' in the government's view, might be just enough to have them address their mandate and legislation.

5) "knock on wood" ... if things don't work out peacefully, i think the public's perception would be based more towards the dfo's lack of accountablity and their favouritism towards special interest groups.

[Rodney]

Good questions with some good answers.

I'm still waiting for people to answer my questions from page three.

allwaysfishin, had a brief chat with one of the directors of SDA tonight. SDA fully supports a protest, but a kill fishery during the protest, no.

"I see no reason not to join in a protest if we can get one together but certainly not to go out and kill fish.  Numerous people will use this as an excuse to take their sockeye and really could give a rip about what the future holds. These people who want to do this need to join a fishing club which gives them representation to the government.  They could also give money to the SDA or plan to attend the fundraiser on Nov. 18th."

Keep in mind the late summers are starting to show up in the river, I dislike the idea of sockeye retention during a protest as well.

With the current openings of the pink and chinook fisheries, and a no-kill protest on the sockeye fishery, I am skeptical to see many would actually show up.

It's the weekend, so information is not being relayed around effectively. I'll be getting more stuff on Monday I'm sure, I'll do my best to drop by the shop the next couple of days to discuss.

[steelie5000]

allwaysfishin, had a brief chat with one of the directors of SDA tonight. SDA fully supports a protest, but a kill fishery during the protest, no.



With the current openings of the pink and chinook fisheries, and a no-kill protest on the sockeye fishery, I am skeptical to see many would actually show up.






  A no kill protest fishery is going to prove what? If it is to bring attention to the (no sockeye for sportmen) then I really doubt anyone, inc DFO will even show up. Last year all the protest fishery did was give Bill a waste of time. If 50 people show up and kill 1 fish each, then DFO will take notice as well as the media. Why do you think the commercial guys are doing it. They are going to kill more fish in one set then all the sports would in a day. Just my 2cents.....